Publish 1: The Warren and Vendors

[gharlane]

Fantastic ! Thanks to all for your hard work.

[macwheeler]

I don't see anything listed about special attacks being changed/fixed? The damage modifiers, speed, states and HAM costs etc? I know this is on Nova and I know it was a point of contention for a while, is it now being pushed live to Basilisk?

[cRush]

I don't see anything listed about special attacks being changed/fixed? The damage modifiers, speed, states and HAM costs etc? I know this is on Nova and I know it was a point of contention for a while, is it now being pushed live to Basilisk?

Might want to look again.

[macwheeler]

Might want to look again.

I have looked twice, maybe you would like to look again? I see HAM costs should now be calculated properly, I also see something about state chances, I see nothing specifically mentioning changes/fixes to special attacks including damage modifier, speed and states.

[cru jodo]

I don't see anything listed about special attacks being changed/fixed? The damage modifiers, speed, states and HAM costs etc? I know this is on Nova and I know it was a point of contention for a while, is it now being pushed live to Basilisk?

Each of these changes are changes that have been posted in the weekly updates. They are simply being patched to the basalisk server. As for exact to the numbers details, I couldn't really quote you that. I'm not a coder, only a communicator. I just try to keep you guys in the know.

[Azlad]

Each of these changes are changes that have been posted in the weekly updates. They are simply being patched to the basalisk server. As for exact to the numbers details, I couldn't really quote you that. I'm not a coder, only a communicator. I just try to keep you guys in the know.

I don't get why this actually made it to the test server in the first place. Screenshots and personal experience determined that the guide was essentially extremely flawed. From states such as "immobilized" and "evading" to making the skills work like their descriptions (which a lot of them never did), the JTL Prima guide looks like the most flawed document and furthest thing form how the game actually functioned. For example, Fan shot is listed as a single target ability when we all know it was the only cone attack Pistoleers ever had. Bodyshot 3 has a lower multiplier than Bodyshot 2, etc. On top of that, wasn't that guide made for the JTL launch when patch 14.1 is what the team is going for? Just confused by all of the contradictions and blatant inconsistencies that have been pointed out by the community in the JTL Prima Guide.

I've been monitoring that thread closely (https://www.swgemu.com/forums/showthread.php?t=46404) and it seems like numerous people, including cRush, have commented on the guide's massive flaws. I don't understand why something so debated and untested at the moment would be pushed out to the play server so quickly. As posted in the 7/15 update (https://www.swgemu.com/forums/showthread.php?t=47674) under Dannuic's updates, he specifically states that the tweaks need some testing as well. Is 7/15 to 7/18 all the time needed to test the values and confirm them? Just seems shady and unnecessarily rushed.

[cRush]

I don't get why this actually made it to the test server in the first place. Screenshots and personal experience determined that the guide was essentially extremely flawed. From states such as "immobilized" and "evading" to making the skills work like their descriptions (which a lot of them never did), the JTL Prima guide looks like the most flawed document and furthest thing form how the game actually functioned. For example, Fan shot is listed as a single target ability when we all know it was the only cone attack Pistoleers ever had. Bodyshot 3 has a lower multiplier than Bodyshot 2, etc. On top of that, wasn't that guide made for the JTL launch when patch 14.1 is what the team is going for? Just confused by all of the contradictions and blatant inconsistencies that have been pointed out by the community in the JTL Prima Guide.

I've been monitoring that thread closely (https://www.swgemu.com/forums/showthread.php?t=46404) and it seems like numerous people, including cRush, have commented on the guide's massive flaws. I don't understand why something so debated and untested at the moment would be pushed out to the play server so quickly. As posted in the 7/15 update (https://www.swgemu.com/forums/showthread.php?t=47674) under Dannuic's updates, he specifically states that the tweaks need some testing as well. Is 7/15 to 7/18 all the time needed to test the values and confirm them? Just seems shady and unnecessarily rushed.

A) Immobilized and Evading are states that are still in the client, and always have been in the client, and a full dump from SOE would have included these states, which was the line of thought when we encountered the guide from the JTL era.
B) Fan shot is also listed as a single target attack in the tool tip in game, which makes it obvious, when considering that a dump was made for Prima from SOE, why they listed it also as a single shot attack.
C) Prima never updated the information in the guide from the pre-launch Prima guide. We assumed that they did. When we found out that they didn't, we investigated SOE forums, and still found that modifiers weren't quite right, but were very much closer than before we changed them.
D) Stop being an asshat trying to make a big deal out of nothing. We are doing our best to recreate this game. What exactly are you doing? Just seems shady that you come on the forums and talk trash instead of help the effort.

[jaguar34]

D) Stop being an asshat trying to make a big deal out of nothing. We are doing our best to recreate this game. What exactly are you doing? Just seems shady that you come on the forums and talk trash instead of help the effort.

here here!! cRush!!

[Azlad]

A) Immobilized and Evading are states that are still in the client, and always have been in the client, and a full dump from SOE would have included these states, which was the line of thought when we encountered the guide from the JTL era.
B) Fan shot is also listed as a single target attack in the tool tip in game, which makes it obvious, when considering that a dump was made for Prima from SOE, why they listed it also as a single shot attack.
C) Prima never updated the information in the guide from the pre-launch Prima guide. We assumed that they did. When we found out that they didn't, we investigated SOE forums, and still found that modifiers weren't quite right, but were closer than before we changed them.
D) Stop being an asshat trying to make a big deal out of nothing. We are doing our best to recreate this game. What exactly are you doing? Just seems shady that you come on the forums and talk trash instead of help the effort.

Wow, did not mean to piss you off. I just did a little reading and I clearly was not understanding why some things were being pushed through so quickly. I thought, as this is a project based extensively on your expertise and the communities awareness and resources, it would be a good idea to discuss this since it was missing in the patch notes and a lot of people seemed to have conflicting opinions. I appreciate your work, and I am eternally grateful for everything you guys do, but I always knew the team for being focused more so on quality instead of quantity. It felt rushed (just my opinion) and I was concerned. Thank you for addressing my concerns in an organized post, I really appreciate that.

A) I had no idea those were still in the client from the original beta, but the guide including the states seemed to look like the guide makers did 0 research and just copied whatever info they saw first. You know first hand that a lot of the skills never worked like their descriptions. The guide lists every skill as it functions according to the in game tool tip, so I was very worried that this might become some kind of iron clad document when I felt it was lacking in correspondence. Thank you for pointing that out for me.

B) That makes a lot of sense, the wording itself is the most confusing part in the end it seems, not the actual functioning of the skill. It makes sense to me now that since this is how the targeting system works, it would be listed as a single target attack in that manner.

C) I'm glad to hear that the modifiers are closer now, but still kind of concerned why we didn't test them more thoroughly before throwing them on Basilisk. I am sure now though, that we will see how the tweaked values behave.

D) Never my intention, sorry for offending you. I too, want to see this game recreated at its best. I think being open and pointing things that a lot of people seem to have missed is an important factor, and that it goes hand in hand with the open source nature of the project.

Sorry again, for offending you or anyone else on the team.

[papilove]

I don't get why this actually made it to the test server in the first place. Screenshots and personal experience determined that the guide was essentially extremely flawed. From states such as "immobilized" and "evading" to making the skills work like their descriptions (which a lot of them never did), the JTL Prima guide looks like the most flawed document and furthest thing form how the game actually functioned. For example, Fan shot is listed as a single target ability when we all know it was the only cone attack Pistoleers ever had. Bodyshot 3 has a lower multiplier than Bodyshot 2, etc. On top of that, wasn't that guide made for the JTL launch when patch 14.1 is what the team is going for? Just confused by all of the contradictions and blatant inconsistencies that have been pointed out by the community in the JTL Prima Guide.

I've been monitoring that thread closely (https://www.swgemu.com/forums/showthread.php?t=46404) and it seems like numerous people, including cRush, have commented on the guide's massive flaws. I don't understand why something so debated and untested at the moment would be pushed out to the play server so quickly. As posted in the 7/15 update (https://www.swgemu.com/forums/showthread.php?t=47674) under Dannuic's updates, he specifically states that the tweaks need some testing as well. Is 7/15 to 7/18 all the time needed to test the values and confirm them? Just seems shady and unnecessarily rushed.

ban this clown please.

[Kyle]

I don't get why this actually made it to the test server in the first place. Screenshots and personal experience determined that the guide was essentially extremely flawed. From states such as "immobilized" and "evading" to making the skills work like their descriptions (which a lot of them never did), the JTL Prima guide looks like the most flawed document and furthest thing form how the game actually functioned. For example, Fan shot is listed as a single target ability when we all know it was the only cone attack Pistoleers ever had. Bodyshot 3 has a lower multiplier than Bodyshot 2, etc. On top of that, wasn't that guide made for the JTL launch when patch 14.1 is what the team is going for? Just confused by all of the contradictions and blatant inconsistencies that have been pointed out by the community in the JTL Prima Guide.

I've been monitoring that thread closely (https://www.swgemu.com/forums/showthread.php?t=46404) and it seems like numerous people, including cRush, have commented on the guide's massive flaws. I don't understand why something so debated and untested at the moment would be pushed out to the play server so quickly. As posted in the 7/15 update (https://www.swgemu.com/forums/showthread.php?t=47674) under Dannuic's updates, he specifically states that the tweaks need some testing as well. Is 7/15 to 7/18 all the time needed to test the values and confirm them? Just seems shady and rushed.

People always remember exactly how things worked at every patch, there is never any question there. The guide isn't perfect, and from JTL, not launch. I can't count how many times people remember things that never existed in the game, or are just plain retarded. People remember different things from different patches. The guide is overall way more accurate than collective memory. There are scrapbook guides to fill in some blanks and confirm points. The only thing memory is good for is a starting place to find real information and to fill in blanks when information just doesn't exist, which is rare. Let me guess, you could do better?

[Azlad]

People always remember exactly how things worked at every patch, there is never any question there. The guide isn't perfect, and from JTL, not launch. I can't count how many times people remember things that never existed in the game, or are just plain retarded. People remember different things from different patches. The guide is overall way more accurate than collective memory. There are scrapbook guides to fill in some blanks and confirm points. The only thing memory is good for is a starting place to find real information and to fill in blanks when information just doesn't exist, which is rare. Let me guess, you could do better?

I definitely could not do better, but I think according to the open source nature of the project it is important to do a lot of testing and get a lot of insight since this seems to be a relatively grey area at the moment. I was never attempting to belittle or begrudge anyone on the team. Instead, I thought it would be important to discuss something that for some reason was not listed in the patch notes and is a massive change to game play. I think you guys are ****ing extraordinary in both your efforts and diligence towards the project, but I also believe that the community has a lot to offer.

People remember what they want to remember from patches, but in the end I think its important to remember that this document is flawed just like anyone elses memory, screenshots, and opinions.

[Lolindir]

I've been monitoring that thread closely (https://www.swgemu.com/forums/showthread.php?t=46404) and it seems like numerous people, including cRush, have commented on the guide's massive flaws. I don't understand why something so debated and untested at the moment would be pushed out to the play server so quickly. As posted in the 7/15 update (https://www.swgemu.com/forums/showthread.php?t=47674) under Dannuic's updates, he specifically states that the tweaks need some testing as well. Is 7/15 to 7/18 all the time needed to test the values and confirm them? Just seems shady and unnecessarily rushed.

You are aware that bas is also a test environment?

[cRush]

I don't see anything listed about special attacks being changed/fixed? The damage modifiers, speed, states and HAM costs etc? I know this is on Nova and I know it was a point of contention for a while, is it now being pushed live to Basilisk?

The modifiers were changed back to basically what they were before, with some changes about how that modifier is calculated. Nothing the end user will really notice as a difference, so why report it? That's why they aren't in the notes.

[macwheeler]

The modifiers were changed back to basically what they were before, with some changes about how that modifier is calculated. Nothing the end user will really notice as a difference, so why report it? That's why they aren't in the notes.

Apologies, I thought that patch notes included all changes that effected game play. So there is more being added in this publish than is listed in the patch notes? Silent fixes and suchlike?