I was thinking on a grander scale than that. I’m a DE who leans more towards the mechanic side then the industrialist side. For example how would you like it if you could take your droid to a DE and in addition to giving it a new paintjob he could do stuff like:
1. Swap personality chips. 2. Increase/Decrease the frequency of droid speech 3. Tune the droid for (Improving one requires sacrificing from one or more of the others) ---Combat ---Movement ---Preformance (Module 1 Bonus) ---Preformance (Module 2 Bonus) ---Repairs ---Other 4. Swap non-combat modules 5. Stick on flames and big exhaust vents
Any other ideas that would help you make your droids more unique?
I dont remember if this was in this thread or the other, but I liked the idea and thought it could use a tweak. Along with how it could work with other ideas.
Oil baths, or maybe a droid shop that would cotain an oilbath. Basically, this would be a special house, just like a medcenter that only a DE can drop. It can be decked out in droid parts and work benches and such, but also contain an oil bath that operates like a garage with the money going towards the owner.
This can work out sort of like how the space stations work. You can repair the decay on your droid by going to the oil bath or through repair kits. And you can make it where if you use the oil bath your droids components decay faster. And maybe have a public one in cities that is just a credit sink too. (seems to work for garages).
Maybe thats part of the key to this. Make droids somewhat similar to ships. You basically buy your droid with whatever components you want. As the droid decays the chassis really doesnt go bad, but the components do.You can repair it, but eventually the components just wear out and have to be replaced, and this can only be done by a DE.
This way, players arent losing their little friends completely, but they DO have to get them fixed if they want to continue to use them.
An other idea is to add a "blowout" modifier. Basically, if your components are low on health, and you continue to use them you have the possibility of a blowout of either that component or maybe even the whole droid. There you'd have a reson for people to keep their droids in working order or risk them losing their components and have to get their droid refurbished earlier. This would idealy get people to stock up on repair kits or use oil baths more frequently.
the only problem with all of this is it can be difficult on some servers to find DE's that are still active. This is part of the reason why I think that the oil bath idea is good because that way you have a static fixture to fix your droid regardless if there is a DE around or not. Plus this gives a nice addon for DEs to have their own specialized building AND give architects something new to build as well.
Sorry if thats a bit rambley...
Jamys Farstrider - Elder Commando, Talusian Resistance PR Director, Spirit of the Fallanassi - http://www.sofgaming.net
"Sometimes, you have to roll a hard six." - Commander William Adama
3. Tune the droid for (Improving one requires sacrificing from one or more of the others) ---Combat ---Movement ---Preformance (Module 1 Bonus) ---Preformance (Module 2 Bonus) ---Repairs ---Other 4. Swap non-combat modules 5. Stick on flames and big exhaust vents
Those things would rock! Guess i need an MSE with huge exhausts... *grin*
Oil baths, or maybe a droid shop that would cotain an oilbath. Basically, this would be a special house, just like a medcenter that only a DE can drop. It can be decked out in droid parts and work benches and such, but also contain an oil bath that operates like a garage with the money going towards the owner.
[...]And maybe have a public one in cities that is just a credit sink too. (seems to work for garages).
Actually that's contraproductive to the thematic. The whole issue is that DEs want more work and income. The DE-owned things would bring cash to the DE, although no more work. Sounds a bit boring to me, placing a building and hoping that it earns money for you without doing anything any more. Nobody else got that, the closest equivalent is a vendor, but even with those you have to pay attention that it's well filled and that it holds good offers.
The second quoted passage then totally defeats the whole purpose of this discussion. It's sure a nice money sink for the devs, but that's it. If people can repair their droids in a public repair facility they will do that. It's the easiest way. (As you're just passing by from or to the starport, stop for a second and fix.) That way you created more trouble for the customer, increasing costs and thus reducing the value of the droid to the customer without any gain for the DE.
Defeats the whole purpose of this discussion, i think, so i vote against it.
I'm pretty sure that there is only one active DE on my server. There might be others but they dont do anything. So one major issue is with all these changes is there going to be DEs to perform this work at all?
The oil bath idea can be changed around to suit needs, but I think that if you are going to impliment a decay system for droids, its a good idea and would be starwarsy since there is one in ANH.
Also getting your droid repaired at an oil bath would be worse for your droids components than using a repair kit so they wouldnt last as long, but is more convenient and easier than trying to track down a repair kit. So smart people would buy repair kits from DE, and their droids would last a little longer than others that use the oil bath.
What this does is give players an alternative if they cant find a DE or dont want to take the time, but it will cost them in the long run and bring more money to the DEs because once the droid craps out, they either have to pick up a new one or have the old one refurbished. I still see that as a win-win situation for the DEs with a balance in there for players to make it a little fairer on them, but still be in the DEs favor.
Jamys Farstrider - Elder Commando, Talusian Resistance PR Director, Spirit of the Fallanassi - http://www.sofgaming.net
"Sometimes, you have to roll a hard six." - Commander William Adama
There needs to be real, useful combat droids in the game. Decay should happen when a droid takes damage. Give combat droids armor condition: just like personal armor, once condition drops past a certain point, resists drop. Armor condition can be repaired, but some loss will be incurred (just like repairing armor). Eventually replacing the droid will be necessary. Note the droid never becomes completely non-functional, it simply isn't as useful anymore without effective armor. The same could be extended to its weapon systems as well.
I don't think non-combat droids should be given any sort of decay. They're used infrequently enough as it is. If useful combat droids are put in with decay, DEs should get quite a bit of repeat business form that, especially considering a combat droid will likely be the most expensive droids they can make.
One factor here is that some people might develop a bit of an emotional attachment to their droid; forced replacement just isn't a good option. One suggestion: when a droid is worn out, just replace the chassis/subsystems with new ones and carry over the droid's personality chip and programming. More personalization options could be implemented to make this more worthwhile.
I don't think non-combat droids should be given any sort of decay. They're used infrequently enough as it is. If useful combat droids are put in with decay, DEs should get quite a bit of repeat business form that, especially considering a combat droid will likely be the most expensive droids they can make.
a buffbot sitting in a house with his droid going 24/7 is considered infrequent use? the issue we have with droids not decaying is from the non-combat droids being used like the buffbot or the doc sitting in the starport using his droid and never needing another one. another thing, if just the combat droids decay, then DE's will be skewed towards making only combat droids, which is something a few of us want to do. we want to make ALL droid options available, not just make 1 or 2 different types for money.
I am currently advancing through DE profession, but my views on decay were formed long before becoming one. I have used droids and creatures since the beginning of the game, and think they add a great deal of fun to the game. Decay of some sort needs to be added though, for both droids and creatures. The vitality system based on creature/droid death is simply not effective enough. But there also needs to be some way to save the identy for those who become attached to their virtual pets.
Since I have been CH and still maintain some skill in it, I know how fast they decay. I have never had to destroy a pet due to vitality degradation. It is a very, very slow decay process even if you use them every fight. As long as you don’t let them die in combat, they are immortal. All but one of my droids are service droids and all are 100/100 vitality. My probot was made second week of game, and he is still 98/100 vitality.
I have seen many ideas about decay here, and some are very good. I really like the idea of modular units that players can change modules in. I think it would be good for both droid engineers and players. It could be designed so that the thing which gives your droid its personality or identity is indestructible, but all other parts degraded. This would allow people to keep their droid identity while making a recurring market for the droid engineer. It also goes along with the spirit of Star Wars as when C3-PO was torn apart and reassembled or when R2-D2 was hit while flying then repaired. It also makes sense that one could modify the hardware of a droid without changing the processor.
In order to achieve a goal like this I would suggest something along the following lines:
Droid Chassis – Can accept modules or module clusters depending on model. These can be added by any player at a “droid repair shop”. These structures would be located in large cities, or placed in player cities by a droid engineer. I would suggest they be placed in less convenient places in the large cities (far from the star port) to encourage players to use the locations in player cities. The chassis would degrade over time as modules were changed out, but would not degrade from usage. All modules are destroyed when removed for replacement except for the Droid Brain/Personality Cluster. Once a Brain is removed from a chassis, the chassis is destroyed. The success while crafting a chassis would have an effect on how many sockets it has depending on model. For example and R2 model might have 1-3 module slots, while and R2 Advanced might have 1-2 socket clusters and 1-2 normal module slots. If a chassis degrades to zero, modules can no longer be exchanged.
Droid Brain/Personality Cluster– This would be the part of the droid that never degrades and is never destroyed. The personality chip (if used) would be applied to this unit when created and could never be changed. It would be genre specific, and when the owner needs to replace his chassis, it must be one of the same genre of chassis (R series in R series chassis; Humanoid in humanoid chassis). The system would assign a unique number to each brain based on model when it was made. When a droid’s name showed it would show the system assigned number on top, and the owner assigned/taught name in parentheses on the bottom (similar to player name with occupation underneath). The identifier would give every droid a uniqueness, but still allow people to give their droid a nickname.
Droid Modules/Clusters – No immediate change except that they degrade over time. Ideas based on time droid is out or on when recharged are all good ideas. Modules would degrade faster from combat than from normal non-combat use.
Other game enhancements this type of system might encourage would be new loot items used for droids. Special module types could drop as loot; Socket clusters with additional slots could drop for droid engineer only use (socket cluster can only be outfitted by a DE, not by a player); Some special chassis styles only made with rare dropped schematics or one time quest schematics; combat droid chassis schematics available as faction perks; and other things along these lines.
I would also like to see chassis type have an effect on droid function. For example; a surgical droid chassis could have an inherent med capability, allowing it to exceed the 110 level with the proper modules installed; LE repair droid chassis could have inherent auto-repair capability; power droid in range of other droids would automatically reduce power consumption by 50%, etc. Right now the model means very little other than how many sockets it has.
These are just some thoughts I have had about the profession. I look forward to enhancement of this aspect of the game as Droids are as much a part of Star Wars as are Jedi and the Force.
************************************************************************************************ "Always two there are, no more, no less. A Master and an Apprentice." - Master Yoda ************************************************************************************************
the idea of having players replace thier own modules in a drod will do more harm than good becuse it will turn DE's into part junkies (where we will do nothing more than factory parts to toss on the bazaar for little return), and if you add modules as a loot drop, we will lose even that little ammount of return, effectively making DE a dead profession. (ie all the oldies will quit and no one new will want to be one because there is soo little return). for the most part, us DE's became DE's to build droids, not droid parts.
the way droids are done atm, there is 0 difference between a MSE droid named 'bob' and an identical one (down to the paint job and modules added) called 'bob', hell there's 0 difference between 2 surgical droids with the same personality chip, modules, and paint job called 'sue'. if the player is so attached, he can roleplay like his bot was like C3-P0 and needed a complete rebuild (aka the DE makes him a completely new droid of the same type, same color, and names it before giving it back to the player) to function again.
the way droids are done atm, there is 0 difference between a MSE droid named 'bob' and an identical one (down to the paint job and modules added) called 'bob'
...
One difference - the new droid doesn't have the old droid's programming.
It'd actually be kind of nice if droids 'learned' over time; i.e., they were instilled with an adaptive AI that became more effective at whatever tasks it's been programmed to do, perhaps even to the point of anticipating its master's needs.
While I am sure that there would be people who would replace droids that wore out, I would not be one of them. None of the droids that I have now do anything important enough for me that I would feel that the expense would be justified.
I do not have a Doctor, so my medical droid would not be a great loss... I can always go to the med center if I need to heal wounds (I usually end up doing that if I'm in a town anyway).
My Entertainers would do without their party droids if they started to decay. They don't do anything really functional anyway.
I would harvest creatures by hand if my harvester droids decayed... I may end up doing this anyway after recent events (in fact, I only saw the threads on this topic after coming here to post about the problems I have recently had with my harvester droids).
I would empty out my storage droids and move the stuff to my house or the bank if it were to decay.
I already refuse to spend money on customization kits because they do wear off over time.
I have replaced droids in the past with better ones that I have either had custom made or found on a DE's vendor, but I would not be willing to replace a droid because it wore out. Several of my characters have had to save up just to buy each droid they own... and in some cases it took me months to collect the credits in the first place. The only way I would be willing to have droids wear out, is if the prices on them came way WAY down... like bazaar prices... and I don't see that happening.
I don't normally post here on the offical forums (normally just a browser) but this thread and Maisland's comments in particular have prompted me to post. Forgive me if this thread is not the proper place to ask this question, but I have not seen any other thread close to topic.
Why as Droid Engineers do we charge so much for our products? I have been a Master DE for about 7 months now, but not for profit. I tried it once before as my exclusive business and I know how hard it can be to maintain profitability since Droids are more toys and convience than essential. Instead I diversified to other products like chefs food and armor. I still offer Droids, but more as a side business. I charge the mean average for my server, maybe a little lower, so I am not undercutting and destroying the economy, but I am not sure why we should charge so much. However, the demand for droids would seem to dictate a lowering of price to compensate for the lack of demand.
Currenlty I can only see Doctor droids have anywhere close to a level of need that could sustain any notion of decay. Combat droids are not very effective against mid to high level enemies PvE and they are almost non-existant as far as PvP goes. Crafting droids are just convience. Same with storage droids. The other modules have varing degrees of usefulness, but most players can and do live without them.
Now what I see in Maisland's post is definitely a concern. You make droids, an already convience item decay, and you threaten what little market exists. Instead of letting new DE's break into the market the old DE's on a server have cornered, you could possibly destroy what little auxilary market that might exist.
Now I am all for some form of decay. It makes sense for an electro-mechanical device as complex as a droid to require regular maintainence. I mean I have my droids with me everywhere. No one can tell me that a droid that goes from the sandstorms of Tatooine to the seamy jungles of Naboo to the cold of deep space is not going to need some form of overhaul regularly. Even your computer that sits at home out of the elements (like the average crafting droid) needs occational visits from a technician. I just think that maybe more “need“ should be built into droids before most customers would truly accept a form of decay.
I think part of the reasons people charge the prices they do is precisely because they know the droid they just sold will last forever. If droids decayed, I'd imagine prices would drop a bit. As far as droids that people would keep buying one way or the other, doctor droids for sure, also harvest droids (once they get fixed), and most likely storage droids (sure you can store your items back in your house/bank, but then they do you no good when you're in the middle of nowhere on dath and just had your armor/gun give out on you).
Jenden Morn - Master of Droids- Tarquinas Droid Engineer Blue Glowy Owner, Operator, and Founder of DarkStar Inc. Groupy of the best band in the galaxy, Solar Flair 3D art of Jenden by Saeelwenea
I wouldn't have a problem if my droids decayed. I haven't had a problem finding a droid engineer on Chilastra - 3 different engineers have made custom droids for me, and I see a droid vendor supplied by different people at nearly every mall I go to. Maybe I'm just fortunate on Chilastra? Or maybe it's just that I don't mind the extra time it takes to personally interact with the droid engineers. I know that I'm not representative of most players, given that I'm not in so much of a hurry to get uber loot and pwn people and whatnot.
Anyway, I do understand the feeling of getting attached to a droid. My medical/crafting station droid became obsolete recently, so I destroyed him. I know I could have just given him away, but I am aware of the no-decay problem. Personally I would actually ENJOY having to go to a droid engineer and getting my droid's modules replaced, since the chassis itself generally doesn't take any wear and tear (besides occasional /bonk). I am one of these guys that enjoys the social aspect to this game, and I have gained some good friendships with my crafted goods suppliers. To keep things moving though, I don't think any kind of overhaul should take any longer than a buffing session or so, and a player will only need to get one every 1 or 2 months, depending on usage.
And please don't make us replace our droid's chassis. Getting a new one of the same kind and color really isn't the same. As money is not a big object for my character, I would pay just as much for an overhaul as I would for a shiny new droid. I can understand about the argument for combat droids needing complete replacement, but in the end, or simplicity's sake, it may be better to make them follow the same decay rules as all the other droids.
= Andrew Chilastra.Palacek
"There's nothing to talk about, Becky. I'm ugly, boys don't like me, and that's it!!"
While I am sure that there would be people who would replace droids that wore out, I would not be one of them. None of the droids that I have now do anything important enough for me that I would feel that the expense would be justified.
I do not have a Doctor, so my medical droid would not be a great loss... I can always go to the med center if I need to heal wounds (I usually end up doing that if I'm in a town anyway).
My Entertainers would do without their party droids if they started to decay. They don't do anything really functional anyway.
I would harvest creatures by hand if my harvester droids decayed... I may end up doing this anyway after recent events (in fact, I only saw the threads on this topic after coming here to post about the problems I have recently had with my harvester droids).
I would empty out my storage droids and move the stuff to my house or the bank if it were to decay.
I already refuse to spend money on customization kits because they do wear off over time.
I have replaced droids in the past with better ones that I have either had custom made or found on a DE's vendor, but I would not be willing to replace a droid because it wore out. Several of my characters have had to save up just to buy each droid they own... and in some cases it took me months to collect the credits in the first place. The only way I would be willing to have droids wear out, is if the prices on them came way WAY down... like bazaar prices... and I don't see that happening.
Well I think that you've touched on a good point...
Droids really are not useful enough and the only good way to get a revamp off the ground with the players of the game would be to make them more useful and meaningful to gameplay to balance it all out.
Maybe make some modules that add modifiers to players stats. Like maybe make the entertainer modules add to healing, or crafter droids give a bonus to crafting or experimentation. And other such uses.
Another idea that I havent seen yet is space droids. They should get decay, especially when you get blown up. Also the remoduling would be nice for space droids since you have different levels of space modules and this would allow you to keep one droid and not have to get a new one as you progress or not have one until you master since its more cost effective that way.
Jamys Farstrider - Elder Commando, Talusian Resistance PR Director, Spirit of the Fallanassi - http://www.sofgaming.net
"Sometimes, you have to roll a hard six." - Commander William Adama
I'm a DE, I've been a DE for a very long time, and I'm totally against Droid decay.
As has been stated before, droids are not all that desierable, sure it's convientinet to sit outside the starport and buff, but how much harder would it be to just sit in the Med center 200 meters away? All droid decay would do is make our product less desireable.
Right now my biggest sellers are Bomb Droids, and Probots (can't quite figure that one out but who am I to argue).
I make ADV MSE bomb droids and ADV R3's. These are one time use droids that keep my business going. With the changes to GCW, PvP will be stepping up and these will sell even more.
I don't think we need decay, I think we need more droids that blow up
