Public Engine3 without time restrictions

[Korsis]

I have wanted for some time to setup a small play server, but hated the time restriction and did not want a hacked version. So i love this idea.

That said, its been awhile since I have looked for server setup/install/engine3 information.

Where should I be looking for applying for this updated engine and or downloading it? Will links to that and the engine be posted in this thread? if not can someone PM me and point me in the right direction.

[Vlada]

I have wanted for some time to setup a small play server, but hated the time restriction and did not want a hacked version. So i love this idea.

That said, its been awhile since I have looked for server setup/install/engine3 information.

Where should I be looking for applying for this updated engine and or downloading it? Will links to that and the engine be posted in this thread? if not can someone PM me and point me in the right direction.

All will be revealed soon™

[TheAnswer]

I'm pretty sure that if it's an individual working on a 'personal' copy of the code with no distribution, than you would be under no obligation to publish source code. GPL/ AGPL is intended to protect published open source work, not personal projects. If, using the given scenario, the individual in question decides that his bug fix is so great that he wants to push it out as his own public play server, at that point it would fall under the provisions of the license. Devs/ CS, if I'm wrong please let me know. Additionally, if this supposed individual was just a really great guy, he ought to get in touch with the devs, as he may be able to make a contribution to the project with what he/she has done.

That's correct, the server cannot be public.

[Kinshi]

https://www.swgemu.com/forums/content...e-restrictions

While it came too late for me as I have exited the SWG emulation scene, I can say I am proud that my server, Tarkin was already behaving under this model for quite some time by making itself Open Source and may have in a small way contributed to this decision by demonstrating that a community server can behave in a legit, responsible manner, and can aide in the mainstream testing and development if it chooses too. There is no good reason for some other community server and SWGEmu to be at odds with each other, it just takes recognizing each others limits and goals, and actively looking for the common ground, and generally not getting in each other's way.

Tarkin may be gone, but I am glad to see this kind of "detente" emerge, and that "Open Source" can maybe live up to its potential in a SWG sense.

I cannot wait to see the effect of AGPL on the overall community..there needs to be a lot of opening up in general.

anyway, kudos on this move.

[JoeSwindell]

Great news!

[oginecka]

Being someone who played SWG since the very first day, I have been watching the project for a couple years now. The time limitation on the engine has always put me off. When I was deciding what project to focus on last year, I opted for Minecraft server development over SWG for that reason.

I can't speak for others, but a part of me is still saddened that SWG closed down a few years ago. It made me realise how uncertain the future of any MMO is and that one day I might not be able to play the game I love. The idea of emulating SWG to me represents the fact that I will be able to launch up SWG 1, 5, 10 or 20 years from now and still be able to play it. It is that sense of security I was looking for and it is something I did not see in SWGEMU. The whole project was always covered by a veil of mystery. The last thing I would want is to invest myself into something SWG related once more, only to find out it disappears on me again due to the engine being closed license.

As someone who can't really code in C, I found the community around SWGEMU somewhat unwelcoming. I have noticed many responses to interested new members come across as "If you can't code, we don't need you". I understand that in part - I have little to contribute in terms of coding. At the same time, I suspect a large part of the original SWG community is just like me - happy go out of our way to keep the idea of SWG going, while not wanting to lose it all for a second time.

My Minecraft community has three developers, but 12 staff members overall. We try to include every interested person to the best of our ability. I have to say that if it wasn't for the interested people who didn't ever provide a single line of code, my project would have never been as polished as it is today.

In the depth of my heart I hope that this change in engine licensing represents not only a way to merge scattered development branches into one, but also a step towards a more welcoming project to those of us not on the dev team. I very much value the work everyone on SWGEMU has put into the project. It is amazing and commendable where everything is in terms of development progress. Even though this may be negative feedback in parts, I'm not writing this to complain, but to offer a slightly different view of SWGEMU, one that perhaps others (those less active on the forums) share with me.

[Tiars]

I actually like this change, especially the aspect that will the exception of the "Private Jedi Unlock" being forced to be shared and in the public domain.

I have strongly advocated that people share their changes and that individual SWGEmu based servers could have a significant distinction between the servers by picking and choosing which features from other servers their community wants. Much of this is also because in moving past SWGEmu 1.0 I see duplication of effort as bad for the community. I see the lasting servers being ones that provide extensions to SWGEmu 1.0 and the servers that die out being those that are simply static or pull code from others without contributing.

I have been working with people that have a launched but not announced server. I see this as something that we would make retroactive for out current changes. We will be one of the first to have our lawyer review the agreement and apply. It also causes me, personally, to want to spend more time working on it and start actively working with this team.

Now some of the possibly lost documentation, that I see people pestering people over are things like:

How to I code the C++ to use .lua files for configuration. (Using this is the best way to for people to add code outside of the .lua scripts and make it configurable.)
How do I create new items.
How do I create new craftable schematics.

These seem to be the common unanswered questions that people would ask about.

[Miztah]

We're going to be working on getting a development wiki up in the near future so that we can start building our documentation back up again. Topics like those will definitely be included.

[jthepunisher]

The engine was not developed with donors money, nothing was developed with donors money, the money went into the running of the servers.

The engine in particular was started by Oru before emu even existed and has since been evolved and incorporated into other commercial software, he/SWGEmu hold full copyright of it. Nobody besides him and me wrote that code.

I do not believe that the engine has been independent of this project and the benefit of it's donations, legal advice, hardware, and testing, but there is no point in arguing that or anything else.

Since you won't make the engine open source will you go on record that you will release the engine free of charge and without limiting time, connections, or placing any other restriction on those that want to run an SWGEmu server?

[stheno2]

This is great news. As i have been taking a break from my EQEmu development lately and messing around in this code and on the swgemu official test servers, it is a very welcome announcement.
I have nothing but positive outlook seeing this going towards a more open model like EQEmu has. They have always been far ahead of just about any emu imo because of it.

Correct me if I am wrong, but as long as the "custom servers" include the code in the server backend that looks to the custom files/folders like lua they are fine.
Much like the way it was previously mentioned. Where it looks for the custom code and moves on if not found. This way the custom lua can be completely hidden from any specific license.
This also allows anyone including the official servers to have private mission files and such.
That complies with most any open source license.

There will always be servers that try to push things. Servers that don't last, and servers that stick around.
If anyone is familiar with EQEmu, you know there is different server ranks. The stable contributing servers are ranked high and noticeably "different" in the server select.
This gives players and player devs an initial immediate view of servers that are worth while to test for bug consistency across builds/servers.

Glad to see this happen. Now I get to split my attention between 2 of my favorite Emus lol

ps. I do hope to see or help make a VS2013 port for Winblows. as I am far more familiar with that IDE than anything else.

[Oru]

I do not believe that the engine has been independent of this project and the benefit of it's donations, legal advice, hardware, and testing, but there is no point in arguing that or anything else.

Engine3 benefited from SWGEmu just as much as from any other projects where it is being used. In exchange for it came free of charge to this open source project.

Since you won't make the engine open source will you go on record that you will release the engine free of charge and without limiting time, connections, or placing any other restriction on those that want to run an SWGEmu server?

Seems our communication is not the very best but this is clearly the intent. The public engine has been limited in order to concentrate testing to one place but since the cat is already out of the bag, there is no point in helding on to this scheme.

It is very common practice for applications to build on 3rd party platforms, frameworks, libraries and such so engine 3 remaining closed source should not affect anyone to any degree.

[TheAnswer]

I do not believe that the engine has been independent of this project and the benefit of it's donations, legal advice, hardware, and testing, but there is no point in arguing that or anything else.

Since you won't make the engine open source will you go on record that you will release the engine free of charge and without limiting time, connections, or placing any other restriction on those that want to run an SWGEmu server?

Yes I have no problems with that, we have always stated that for 1.0 release the engine will be released fully unlocked.

Actually the plan is to lift AGPL in core3 when 1.0 is released, thats why we put the disclaimer, and let communities do whatever they want with the code, but till we get there we want cooperation from everyone.

[Tiars]

We're going to be working on getting a development wiki up in the near future so that we can start building our documentation back up again. Topics like those will definitely be included.

I am both really glad to hear this and sad. I finally got my environment up and working last December and most of my time in the development environment has been trying to learn my way around the code. I know that I have royally s****** up the code in my VM several times and had to reset it while I have been learning it. So I am glad to hear this.

My experience though in trying to get things documented when there is no documentation is that this can be considerable work. Unfortunately those who are best prepared to quickly provide the documentation are also the most productive in writing code. Plus as a volunteer project I also understand that there may be some problem dragging people away from the fun stuff to provide documentation. But I also know that when it is up I will try to provide what little I have deciphered to help it along.

[jthepunisher]

Engine3 benefited from SWGEmu just as much as from any other projects where it is being used. In exchange for it came free of charge to this open source project.


Seems our communication is not the very best but this is clearly the intent. The public engine has been limited in order to concentrate testing to one place but since the cat is already out of the bag, there is no point in helding on to this scheme.

It is very common practice for applications to build on 3rd party platforms, frameworks, libraries and such so engine 3 remaining closed source should not affect anyone to any degree.

Thank you both. I really appreciate you taking the time to respond to some tough questions. That shows a lot of class. As long as the goal is to give everyone open access to SWG I am happy.

[Ki-Fu]

Kudos.....