Death and Taxes...

[Oru]

Before we get into the nitty-gritty details, let me reintroduce myself to the newer community members as I have stayed in the shadows for quite a while. I'm one of the founders of this project, and my main contribution was developing the foundations of the current server core. As the project grew and taxation obligations arose, my main focus moved away from the actual development. I chose to start the non-profit company in Hungary that helped us going forward in this situation, which leads up to today's topic.

Recently as part of a regular process, the Hungarian tax authority decided to review our company and they found an issue with how we paid for a specific provider.

In 2013 we started using services from a US-based company Softlayer to provide servers for our systems. When we set up the account, Softlayer asked us for our VAT ID, and I offered it without fully understanding the implications. The VAT ID is a number used in the European Union to track transactions between companies to manage taxation. I did not realize that by providing this VAT ID that Softlayer would start invoicing us from an EU based company (instead of the US) and in the EU this makes the buyer responsible for the taxes on the goods and services delivered. I didn't know this was an issue, and our accountant did not notice it either. Because of that, we did not report these VAT transactions nor did we pay the related taxes, because, as far as I knew we were a "tax-exempt non-profit" company.

There is still time to correct the filings and pay the missing taxes without any additional fees. Had I originally paid Softlayer’s US entity we would have paid $6,237 (8,5%) more than what we did pay. Sadly because we can’t go back in time and pay the Softlayer US entity we now have to pay an estimated $10,068 USD in EU back-taxes. In the end this mistake cost us $3,831 USD. The bigger issue is we have to catch-up with these costs now and I feel horrible because my lack of knowledge of the arcane tax codes has put our project at risk.

I feel doubly conflicted even sharing this situation with you because in October it got out that the project was in financial trouble because donations were lower than our monthly operating expenses. The amazing part that shocked me was that the community reacted quickly and people donated $8,510 in one month. This extra inflow of cash should have put the project in a great place with the ability to continue the way we are with a comfortable pad for unexpected expenses and other yearly costs (e.g., accounting and legal). However now we need to make up for the back taxes and balance that against keeping enough cash to keep the project moving.

We have always been transparent and open about the financial details of this project because we value the community's trust above all. We're not asking the community for more help, we will use $5,000 USD of the funds we already have, and handful of the staff and myself will pitch in to help me cover the remaining $5,068 USD. This will leave about one month of operating cash in the company and if donations stay at our current goal we should be able to continue the project barring unforeseen circumstances.

I'm really sorry for the whole mess and take full responsibility for what has happened here. I have always cared for the good of this project and will continue to find ways to keep it going as long as people are interested in it.

In the end we feel we can navigate this speed bump and get back to our original mission. Above all I felt it is essential to maintain your trust that we share the details of this situation with you.

May the force be with you,
Oru

UPDATE:

tax balance sheet: https://drive.google.com/file/d/18ay...fN1WYflUh/view

U[/URL]PDATE 2:

tax inspection report: [URL="https://drive.google.com/open?id=1qmg6GVqbRd7AnJKSF9_D7zTx4Lo25wJ9"]https://drive.google.com/open?id=1qm..._D7zTx4Lo25wJ9 (https://drive.google.com/file/d/18aynFlz_YXCt9ehTdD3xf0YfN1WYflUh/view)

[Oru]

reserved for future updates

[Oru]

reserved for more future updates

[sithrosex]

Taxation is theft :/
love the emu you helped co-found btw

[nee2earth]

Before we get into the nitty-gritty details, let me reintroduce myself to the newer community members as I have stayed in the shadows for quite a while.

The amazing part that shocked me was that the community reacted quickly and people donated $8,510 in one month.


I have no doubt WE shall rally together and come through once again. Whatever it takes.

I've already begun reaching out to everyone (in the shadows too, using an alias, since I know how much You & the others hate me 'Nee' ) the moment i saw your OP, just like i assured Vlada we'd do back in October.

And I'm certain people like Mobyus1 will be doing the same on social-media, not to mention the slew of Vets still lurking about the forums & side-servers after all these years.

Despite everything, I thank you for the honesty & details... and I'll just leave you with this collective sentiment:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H23z9Nv_GsE

[Mobyus1]

Thanks for the detailed explanation. I should have something up by Sunday night to help spread the word.

[Misk Brebran]

While the yearly statements do let us know of the financial details of the project, I for one greatly appreciate the openness you have displayed in letting us know the financial situation. Thanks!!

;]

—-break, break—-

Ladies and gents,

Lets keep this thread moving to the top for vis along with whatever Mobyus has planned (I miss poking SWIPErs when they stopped in NIKA for a rest).

Cheers and Merry Christmas Emu!!

[Serrabell]

Thanks for letting us know what is going on, it is greatly appreciated! I also will spread the word where I can.

[Voronsky]

Thank you for the continuous transparency and genuine sincerity. I will contribute something next paycheck!

[Bishop Will]

*Whips out Wallet* "It will be done"


Merry Christmas everyone!

[Mauriac]

Not understanding the intricacies of international tax regulation? UNACCEPTABLE! /s

Just glad to hear we're still moving forward and that this won't have a detrimental effect. My regular donation will come out this month as usual!

[Jaws]

The game has given to me, therefore I give back to the game. Don't sweat it, we all make mistakes.

[Walking carpet]

Dealing with our own countries laws is already something , can only imagine what it should be for you dealing with those international trading laws, Mistakes are made by everyone in this world so please Oru dont put it too hard on yourself , your not alone , where all here and caring for this project and its staff no matter how silent they can be at times , we know they are there, doing there jobs like they should and doing it professionally keeping the focus on end goals.

The community will respond to this youll see and everyone will spend the holidays with warm in there hearts :)
Moby let me know when your video is done so i can share it to all NRN medias
happy holidays everyone keep faith *S*

[Qui-larek]

/makeitso

Oops wrong game

Merry Christmas / Happy Holidays (delete as you see fit)

[Vlada]

While we are grateful for the sudden influx of donations, I feel like i need say that this thread wasn't posted with that intent at all. Oru and the rest of the staff just wanted to keep the community in the loop. Yes we had some trouble with Hungarian tax authorities, yes we did have some unexpected expenses, but it was all covered and we're moving forward. I think LK said it best:

https://i.imgur.com/nBpffhF.jpg


On a more personal note, your concern, your dedication as well as your donations are humbling and deeply appreciated.

Thank you for being awesome.

[Qui-larek]

We know Vlada, nothing wrong with a little /burstrun every once in a while

[Praxi34]

Thanks for letting us know ORU. I live in the UK and run a Beauty and Aesthetics business and the tax and VAT issues are awfully arcane. Hitting the VAT threshold in the UK is a full time job in itself paying it back!!!!

I will make sure I donate a bit more this month to help cover some of the costs.

[Mobyus1]

Video is recorded, edited, and rendering. Will be available later tonight.

https://i.imgur.com/3ypQWt3.png

...yes, I know it says "ChannelUpdate_July18" ... but it's not.

[Praxi34]

Video is recorded, edited, and rendering. Will be available later tonight.

https://i.imgur.com/3ypQWt3.png

...yes, I know it says "ChannelUpdate_July18" ... but it's not.



Awesome good work Mobyus1

[Mobyus1]

Alright, it's posted. Spread the word. And thanks to everyone who's already donated!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypM7h2GHDts

[Walking carpet]

Alright, it's posted. Spread the word. And thanks to everyone who's already donated!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypM7h2GHDts

Ohh Yeah tanx bro :)

Vlada stop playing with the taxes heheh

[Misk Brebran]

Alright, it's posted. Spread the word. And thanks to everyone who's already donated!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypM7h2GHDts

Good vid as always, thx Mob!

[Vlada]

Ohh Yeah tanx bro :)

Vlada stop playing with the taxes heheh


This is a serious thread so ill refrain from explaining what I'm playing with most of the time.

[dust906]

if i was to voice my first thought after reading this.

It would be that i think the entire dev community should come out and just do a QA live one night.
we don't hear from you guys enough in my opinion and if you want us to pull together, it would just be nice to see that from the devs, even when not in a bad spot.

just looking for more communication with the base.

[Mobyus1]

if i was to voice my first thought after reading this.

It would be that i think the entire dev community should come out and just do a QA live one night.
we don't hear from you guys enough in my opinion and if you want us to pull together, it would just be nice to see that from the devs, even when not in a bad spot.

just looking for more communication with the base.

I would be down to host such a thing... like a livestream with staff on Discord or something. I think it'd be too difficult to get everyone together at the same time though.

[nee2earth]

It would be that i think the entire dev community should come out and just do a Q&A session live one night.
we don't hear from you guys enough in my opinion .

I actually used to irritate the devs about that very thing quite a lot back when i was on-staff, even trying to organize something with less pressure (like a Newsletter) to augment the Year-End-Updates.

But in retrospect, i came to realize not only how impractical it was but also how unnecessary.

Reason being: Most, if not all, of the entire current Dev Team (https://www.swgemu.com/forums/showgroups.php) is readily available for questions 24/7 in IRC & Discord, as well as on these forums.

----



like a livestream with staff

. I think it'd be too difficult to get everyone together at the same time though.

Bingo ^ , therein lies the main hurdle. RL time management.

We all have to remember that these are not paid SOE employees required by corporate to do 'Stratics live chats' (https://www.swgemu.com/archive/scrapbookv51/data/20070131233305/index.html) periodically for PR. These are noble volunteers, working in their spare time. And 99% of that spare time is typically spent coding & testing.

Letting them work in peace seems to indeed be the best method for consistant progress (https://www.swgemu.com/forums/showthread.php?t=75).

[Surrena]

It was nee who reported you to magyar tax gestapo.

Also anyone notice that vladas post went from 32k to 52k in matter of days? He must be god at posting!

[Vlada]

I actually used to irritate the devs about that very thing quite a lot back when i was on-staff.

I think both you and they will have to agree that you irritated them about many other things as well. :p


Also anyone notice that vladas post went from 32k to 52k in matter of days? He must be god at posting!

I think i know what it is, posts that shouldn't count towards post count are showing up now because i was messing with some settings, ill see if i can fix it today.

EDIT: Should be fixed now. Thanks for letting me know.

[Kurgol]

Don't feel bad, you guys do an amazing job for volunteers. I have donated as much as I can afford, I'm sure you guys will be back in the black soon =)

[lordkator]

if i was to voice my first thought after reading this.

It would be that i think the entire dev community should come out and just do a QA live one night.
we don't hear from you guys enough in my opinion and if you want us to pull together, it would just be nice to see that from the devs, even when not in a bad spot.

just looking for more communication with the base.

I'm generally supportive of open communication between staff and community.

We have a number of challenges on the Q&A front:

Trolls
We're all volunteers and on five different timezones world-wide.
All of us have day jobs so scheduling is tough (yes some work on the weekends)
Currently there is very little to discuss, we're very clear on our goal and it's set in stone.
Managing Q&A is stressful, and in this context most Q's will be off topic because of our clear milestone.
People who's Q's don't get addressed feel like we're not listening or being defensive.
We often make a lot of technical decisions but we make very few if any design decisions because we're trying to emulate a point in time, not fix it (yet).
Given 1 hour to code vs 1 hour of Q&A which would you really rather our devs spend time on?
See #1


One of my concerns is that the people on the forums are not the bulk of people in the game.
Lots of people in the game, login, play, have fun, logout, live their lives, come back again later.
Only a small percent actually make it the forums. And we also have a lot of people in the forums who never play the game.
This imbalance makes communication here biased in a way that is not easy to correct for.

All this said as you may have noticed I've been trying to carve out more time for the community. All of us on staff know its important, however it is incredibly time consuming and challenging.

Perhaps we could start with the community voting on a couple questions (NOT IN THIS THREAD) and we can try to have a thoughtful answer to the top couple of questions on a weekly basis.



(P.S. If you try to get Q&A questions started on this tread I'll ask the mods to delete your post)

[Mobyus1]

One of my concerns is that the people on the forums are not the bulk of people in the game.
Lots of people in the game, login, play, have fun, logout, live their lives, come back again later.
Only a small percent actually make it the forums. And we also have a lot of people in the forums who never play the game.
This imbalance makes communication here biased in a way that is not easy to correct for.

This is 100% accurate.


All this said as you may have noticed I've been trying to carve out more time for the community. All of us on staff know its important, however it is incredibly time consuming and challenging.

Perhaps we could start with the community voting on a couple questions (NOT IN THIS THREAD) and we can try to have a thoughtful answer to the top couple of questions on a weekly basis.

That'd be a great new thing that should only take a few minutes of your time each week. =D

[nee2earth]

Perhaps we could start with the community voting on a couple questions (NOT IN THIS THREAD) and we can try to have a thoughtful answer to the top couple of questions on a weekly basis.


That'd be a great new thing that should only take a few minutes of your time each week.

Actually, we tried that already...
https://www.swgemu.com/forums/showthread.php?t=183748
...and it didn't seem to go as planned.

Probably for reasons i listed in my other post in this thread (https://www.swgemu.com/forums/showthread.php?t=218028&page=2&p=1557377&viewfull=1#post1557377), which LK's subsequent post seemed to reiterate.

That said, more communication (and less 'Nee' ) typically is a good thing; depending upon the listener(s) .

----

I think both you and they will have to agree that you irritated them about many other things as well. :p

.

Everything was born out of a sheer desire to help, but I'd say the feeling was often mutual. :wall:

None of that stuff matters now though, at least not to me anyway. What matters is: Our community rallied yet again and donations are GREEN.

See ya next month---err, year. :hiding:

[Surrena]

I'm generally supportive of open communication between staff and community.



All this said as you may have noticed I've been trying to carve out more time for the community. All of us on staff know its important, however it is incredibly time consuming and challenging.

Perhaps we could start with the community voting on a couple questions (NOT IN THIS THREAD) and we can try to have a thoughtful answer to the top couple of questions on a weekly basis.



(P.S. If you try to get Q&A questions started on this tread I'll ask the mods to delete your post)

What if we had list of questions sent to you in advance and mobyus could do a podcast of some sort on his stream or youtube video.

[Mauriac]

I quite honestly don't understand what questions people want/need answered. The biggest ones either don't have answers by their very nature or have very clearly laid out answers from what I've understood.

To me it seems a Q&A would only help those who aren't savvy enough to read the MANY stickied threads that contain all of the project specifications and status updates. Is this something needed? Am I missing something here?

In the end I am just happy that this project is still running at all and from the looks of things will reach completion. Hi 5's all around for that.

[Mobyus1]

I quite honestly don't understand what questions people want/need answered. The biggest ones either don't have answers by their very nature or have very clearly laid out answers from what I've understood.

To me it seems a Q&A would only help those who aren't savvy enough to read the MANY stickied threads that contain all of the project specifications and status updates. Is this something needed? Am I missing something here?

In the end I am just happy that this project is still running at all and from the looks of things will reach completion. Hi 5's all around for that.

I can only speak for myself, but I'd get one very important thing out of it... a sense for who the staff are as people. I wouldn't mind having the opportunity to ask a handful of them a couple of questions that we all already know the answers to just to hear them actually respond verbally as opposed to reading it via text on a forum. It would make them more personable and, hopefully, likable (not that we don't like them already). Text is too easy to incorrectly add tone to, so actually hearing it straight from their mouths would give us a better look at how passionate they are about this labor of love.

...but that's just me.

[shadow2kx]

One of my concerns is that the people on the forums are not the bulk of people in the game.
Lots of people in the game, login, play, have fun, logout, live their lives, come back again later.
Only a small percent actually make it the forums. And we also have a lot of people in the forums who never play the game.
This imbalance makes communication here biased in a way that is not easy to correct for.



This is 100% accurate.


SOE devs told us the same thing back in the day. Quiet people are happy people.

Regardless, I don't know what good a QA session would do. If people want to ask questions, the staff here does answer. The tone of some of those answers may sometimes be an issue, but that's entirely different than them not being available to us to talk to.

[zimbab]

I do have 1 question that I wanna ask... but I will not and not in this thread :)

Just gonna say keep up the good work team :) :) we are still behind you :)

[Qui-larek]

As long as you keep coding we will keep donating

Its that simple and at the end of this part of the journey we can all have a nice cup of tea :)

[ottor]

Hey there,
I do not post very often on forums but i read it everyday (or almost) you give me here the occasion to thank all the staff for the amazing great job done over the years and to say that everybody can make mistakes (and the real mistake is the tax itself...).
I'll be glad to help thanks again and happy holidays from France guys !

[Valkyra]

One of my concerns is that the people on the forums are not the bulk of people in the game.
Lots of people in the game, login, play, have fun, logout, live their lives, come back again later.
Only a small percent actually make it the forums. And we also have a lot of people in the forums who never play the game.
This imbalance makes communication here biased in a way that is not easy to correct for.

All this said as you may have noticed I've been trying to carve out more time for the community. All of us on staff know its important, however it is incredibly time consuming and challenging.

Perhaps we could start with the community voting on a couple questions (NOT IN THIS THREAD) and we can try to have a thoughtful answer to the top couple of questions on a weekly basis.

That's true, it does seem that individuals whom are more 'vocal' on the forum don't make up the entirety of the population playing/testing on SWGEmu servers... Even though there's a requirement to read forum threads before proceeding, someone can create an account and not even use the forums before logging in.

I think account creation/management systems definitely need a revamp since cRush initially wrote them, but of course just more work to detract from the end goal of a 14.1 SWG emulation. I know it's a lot to consider in all points fully, but Bas has been up for many years now, but it's kind of a decision on revamping registration processes to make things more uniform/concise with the user experience, or focus all efforts into making 1.0. Perhaps some sort of systems could be brainstormed on how to keep players more engaged with the forums and ask for their opinions on things. I feel like there's some kind of correlation between players that are swayed away from wanting to playtest on SWGEmu servers and what could be done about account management, such as further systems to help prevent multiple accounts, but that's another issue for another time.

I do want to say I appreciate all the outside answers you and other SWGEmu team members give on a constant basis about advanced questions on what you all have learned, such as compiling opinions. I think a rift between dev/team members of a project and a community, in a scope similar to what SWGEmu does is detrimental to the project as a whole, but of course you can only do so much for a community on what each member has on their plate inside and outside of SWG-related matters.

I feel that a weekly basis Q&A could be ideal, but maybe make it monthly instead, and pick & chose a few questions a team member could issue a response to in a monthly update based off questions submitted/screened due to time restraints (instead of weekly as suggested.)

[LordSniper]

there's no way to know every country's tax code

thank you guys for all the hard work and dedication !! happy holidays!

[Misk Brebran]

I feel that a weekly basis Q&A could be ideal, but maybe make it monthly instead, and pick & chose a few questions a team member could issue a response to in a monthly update based off questions submitted/screened due to time restraints (instead of weekly as suggested.)

This ^^^^^ sounds like a great idea, at least to me it does. One team member a month (weekly seems like alot of work) interviewed by Mobyus (if hes willing and can coord times) or just self videoed by the team member answering several community posted questions they want to address. Maybe have a question thread dedicated strictly to this process. It would cover several bases at once, i.e. allowing us to get to know the team (and vice versa), using community posted questions (Emu or otherwise), posting the session in a dedicated thread for the interviews/sessions (no additional comments for the thread).

Something like this doesnt seem like it would be taking alot of time away from the proj and the time it does take away I think is worth it. The interview/video could be scheduled in advanced, it doesnt have to be coordinated with several ppl at one time and the team member answering the questions can take as long as they like. Maybe every so often Mobyus could do the interview like thing for an extended session...idk, but i do like the idea of getting the know the team better and not just concerning the Emu, but other things that goes on in their lives as well. Maybe a tester could have an interview some time to turn the tables a bit. Nothing wrong with that either and lets the community AND the team get to know each other a little better as well.

I know not everyone uses the forums, just throw out a system wide msg, email or maybe even a statement linked to the launcher stating when the next vid will be posted. Then at least everyone has the opportunity to look if they so desire. I bet if more ppl knew what the forums were for, more ppl would come look.

:::steps down from mic and podium, deposits two cents in piggybank on side of stage and slowly moves away keeping an eye on the crowd:::

Cheers!

[Lolindir]

This thing have not yet been discussed in staff, but I don't think we should start to expect members of the community or team to be willing to have their face on video or to talk about things in their life outside of SWGEmu. If they want to, that's fine, if they don't want to, that have to be fine to. Having your words in a forum post is one thing, having your face out over social media, is another. Different people, different boundaries.

I'm posting this just to make sure we don't make an expectation that people, who contribute for various reasons, needs to be on video, or have their voice heard. We wish that anyone who wants the be anonymous can be just that. That is why we have the 2.4 rule in our TOS. As soon as you say yes to something like this, that anonymous is gone.

I'm not negative to the concept, but we have to respect peoples boundaries, if they voice one.

[lordkator]

This thing have not yet been discussed in staff, but I don't think we should start to expect members of the community or team to be willing to have their face on video or to talk about things in their life outside of SWGEmu. If they want to, that's fine, if they don't want to, that have to be fine to. Having your words in a forum post is one thing, having your face out over social media, is another. Different people, different boundaries.

I'm posting this just to make sure we don't make an expectation that people, who contribute for various reasons, needs to be on video, or have their voice heard. We wish that anyone who wants the be anonymous can be just that. That is why we have the 2.4 rule in our TOS. As soon as you say yes to something like this, that anonymous is gone.

I'm not negative to the concept, but we have to respect peoples boundaries, if they voice one.

+10000, I totally agree.

Some of us are very public and other private but contribution has nothing to do with either choice.

As much "fun" as it would be for people to see a video from each member of staff I don't think it will drive the project further forward any faster.

Again I'm for some balance here, just want to agree with what Lolindir is saying.

I also want to be clear, driving people or forcing them to the forums is not something I would support. I know it's shocking but there are many people who want nothing to do with the forums, nor do they want to be forced to interact with them. It's hard to understand for all of us that are very comfortable here. Most people are lurkers and many more don't want anything to do with it.

I've been thinking on this a lot recently, I don't have a good set of answers yet but I will keep noodling on it and will share my thoughts in a new thread when I'm further along in my process.

[Mobyus1]

This thing have not yet been discussed in staff, but I don't think we should start to expect members of the community or team to be willing to have their face on video or to talk about things in their life outside of SWGEmu. If they want to, that's fine, if they don't want to, that have to be fine to. Having your words in a forum post is one thing, having your face out over social media, is another. Different people, different boundaries.

I'm posting this just to make sure we don't make an expectation that people, who contribute for various reasons, needs to be on video, or have their voice heard. We wish that anyone who wants the be anonymous can be just that. That is why we have the 2.4 rule in our TOS. As soon as you say yes to something like this, that anonymous is gone.

I'm not negative to the concept, but we have to respect peoples boundaries, if they voice one.

Perhaps I missed it because, I won’t lie, some of the posts in this thread have gotten super long and I ended up simply skimming through them, but I don’t believe anyone is suggesting someone actually show their face in an interview. I can say that if I were to conduct one, I’d prefer to do it in-game. As a matter of fact, I’ve already done an interview with ViT, the second person to unlock Jedi on Basilisk, and all we did for that was have a chat on Discord while I drove around on Yavin solo. He did, let me record his toon killing mobs for an intro segment, but that’s about it.

I also don’t believe anyone is suggesting that if you’re a member of staff or a contributor in any way that you’re automatically forced to do an interview of some kind. Of course this would be a voluntary activity as is everything regarding the project.

I’m seeming to remember something called “Community Spotlight”... I don’t remember if it was from Live or from some other game I used to play, but iirc each month there would be a post about a random member of the community; including such things as who they are, how they got into the game, how long they’ve been playing, their favorite part of the game, etc... I think bringing something like that back, even if it’s managed by a player rather than staff, would be beneficial to the community. And then perhaps every so often, we could throw a staff member into the mix to learn a bit about those that want to share. And again, in case it’s not obvious, we’re not sharing SSNs or anything personal here... it’s all about Star Wars and gaming.

[Hoghi]

OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOH

thanks

[Lolindir]

Perhaps I missed it because, I won’t lie, some of the posts in this thread have gotten super long and I ended up simply skimming through them, but I don’t believe anyone is suggesting someone actually show their face in an interview. I can say that if I were to conduct one, I’d prefer to do it in-game. As a matter of fact, I’ve already done an interview with ViT, the second person to unlock Jedi on Basilisk, and all we did for that was have a chat on Discord while I drove around on Yavin solo. He did, let me record his toon killing mobs for an intro segment, but that’s about it.

I also don’t believe anyone is suggesting that if you’re a member of staff or a contributor in any way that you’re automatically forced to do an interview of some kind. Of course this would be a voluntary activity as is everything regarding the project.
Its not said explicit video with face an all, I just wanted to put it out there, so that we all understand that some are more private than others. Some enjoy been on forum, talking to the community, others don't.


I’m seeming to remember something called “Community Spotlight”... I don’t remember if it was from Live or from some other game I used to play, but iirc each month there would be a post about a random member of the community; including such things as who they are, how they got into the game, how long they’ve been playing, their favorite part of the game, etc... I think bringing something like that back, even if it’s managed by a player rather than staff, would be beneficial to the community. And then perhaps every so often, we could throw a staff member into the mix to learn a bit about those that want to share. And again, in case it’s not obvious, we’re not sharing SSNs or anything personal here... it’s all about Star Wars and gaming.
Way back, at the start of me joining staff, we had a "newspaper" circulating the forum. Most was satire as I remember it, but there where some interviews... Or i might be mixing it up. It was a long time ago.

[Misk Brebran]

Just to clear up my comment above, I agree with all of you 100% on keeping anonymity and only answering questions ppl are comfortable with answering because boundaries are huge in all aspects of our lives. I hold no expectations for and nor do I wish to impose any expectations on anyone in the community. I do really appreciate the opportunity provided by the staff that we have been given to be a part of the testing and community here at the Emu. I should probably have used an audio interview or IG (as Mobyus mentioned about) interview as an example since those will keep the identities secure for all involved. Not looking to pry into personal lives here, just to increase community cohesiveness. I wouldnt want anyone forced to do something they didnt want to i.e. to come to the forums, participate in an session or even play a toon they dont like, lol. Only looking to make the info of the forums more readily known. I have met a few (not many) new to, not only the Emu, but also SWG who had no idea there was the plethora of info available on the forums that we have.

Sorry if I caused any confusion, intent was only to introduce more ideas for the brainstorm :] Have a wonderful Emu day!!

[nee2earth]

I don't have a good set of answers yet but I will keep noodling on it and will share my thoughts in a new thread when I'm further along in my process.

Or just use the Dev Q&A sticky thread that already exists---> https://www.swgemu.com/forums/showthread.php?t=183748
(Could even have Vlada remove any remnants of 'Nee', if it's such a turn-off. But regardless of how anyone feels about me, that ^ existing thread was literally made to accomplish at least some of what people are craving here. )

----

Perhaps I missed it because some of the posts in this thread have gotten super long and I ended up simply skimming through them, .

I thought i had linked this earlier in one of my prior posts but i might've forgotten:
https://www.swgemu.com/forums/showthread.php?t=270
(Yes, that ^ sticky thread is a bit out-dated, but again it seems to be exactly what u guys are wishing for, no? Except for the voice/video aspect. )

---


I’m seeming to remember something called “Community Spotlight”... I don’t remember if it was from Live or from some other game I used to play, but iirc each month there would be a post about a random member of the community

3 times Nee ain't the charm but...
https://www.swgemu.com/forums/showthread.php?t=183784
...if you do end up creating a NEW 'Community Spotlight' video or whatever, i still have all the PM's i received from all those guild-leaders and i'd be more than happy to share the info (Pending their approval of course --- It's not private info or anything. It's just IN-GAME tidbits & such, but i'd still ask for permission before passing it along. They're just collecting dust at this point though, since the 'featurette' idea never came to fruition...for various reasons. )

Also, in case you were thinking of the old original SOE version, here it is:

http://web.archive.org/web/20050303170520/http://starwarsgalaxies.station.sony.com:80/content.jsp?page=SWG%20Newsletter%20Sign%20Up

I could be wrong (shocker!) but i think we'd need to be very cautious with any such SWGEmu 'Newsletter' , outside of these forums, just cuz of the whole SW licensing/branding implications.

Best to keep a low-key lower-profile type approach imo. And i suspect most of the Devs feel the same way. (Heads down, hard at work, etc. )

Just my 2 credits. :twitchwl9:

[Misk Brebran]

Just my 2 credits. :twitchwl9:

Shouldnt that be .02 credits? :)

[Andewa]

I haven't posted in years, but I do keep track of what's going on. I've been following the project since early 2007, and I even recall helping Kyle gather crafting schematics.

Taxation is theft, and I'll gladly donate to help mitigate that.

Keep it up guys.

[eallend7]

Been following this thread, new to Basilisk but played a version of the Emu 4 years ago.

Just wanna commend everyone who donates and those who put so much sweat equity into this project, it's awesome and something I didn't think I would ever get to experience again!

On the subject of Q&A's and what not, being a newer individual to the server, I'm familiar with the game, but when looking for a server I had a lot of concerns initially, such as:

Is SwgEmu one server? Or a model that many servers are based on? (Figured that out)
What are the differences in the servers? (I pretty much know this answer)
Which server is the most populated, why? (Kind of know this answer)
Are any of these servers even alive anymore?

The last question comes from a quick google search and a quick scan to see when the latest posts on the forums were, I know not everyone, as you guys have said, even looks at the forums, maybe most log in, play, logout and repeat.

However, for me, especially with a project like this where it's not a given that there will be hundreds of folks to play with, the involvement of the community that literally make the game worth working on is what I looked for first.
Long story short, there maybe an untapped following who read before installing, and if there were more consistent activity on the forum, maybe those folks would come out of the shadows.

Just my thoughts.

Glad to be here.

[dust906]

some of what i am talking about comes from the proposal that there needs to be a promotional effort to get people in the know about how close this is to completion.
interaction with the community is always the way to go in my opinion to making sure that the base is all connected..

im not in any way trying to start anything that is going to be catering to anyone.
i just suggesting a quarterly Q&A with the base.

you can throw out a ingame email also saying "hey were doing a Q&A on da da da..

everyone working but christmas is a holiday where people come together, and this should be no different for how many years we have put into this game

[Bulba]

I'm sorry for casting aspersions or for any negative implications. But I saw this question elsewhere and I couldn't find an answer :

How many people in the project team have access to this accountant?

If it's more than one, can the other person(s) verify what Oru has said?

This accountant should have known the tax implications. And they should have had professional insurance to cover a mistake like this. That's what they are paid for.

[lordkator]

I'm sorry for casting aspersions or for any negative implications. But I saw this question elsewhere and I couldn't find an answer :

How many people in the project team have access to this accountant?

If it's more than one, can the other person(s) verify what Oru has said?

This accountant should have known the tax implications. And they should have had professional insurance to cover a mistake like this. That's what they are paid for.

I’ve addressed this “elsewhere” but as a repeat here:

I want to be clear, I know it's hard to understand the tax situation but its as real as death and I am personally contributing a large sum of money along with others on staff to just make it go away. I trust Oru deeply, I've spoken with him and I have spent many hours of my life with the core team working to make our environment work like a clock so we're all having fun. What is often not said or understood is the devs enjoy, well, being devs and we want the community to enjoy the results of our work. Meanwhile, it comes as a stab directly to the heart when trolls attack, we are just people like everyone else, we have lives, children, dogs, cats, and work and we come to this community contributing our skills to have fun and empower others to have fun. Its fun to think of conspiracy theories but Occam's razor teaches us the simplest explanation is most likely. I've seen the documents, I've used google translate to read them (hard but not impossible) and the situation satisfies me enough that I'm helping pay the bill directly with my own personal money. I've run companies for 25 years of my life and I know how complicated it can be, how expensive lawyers and accountants are and how easy it is to make a costly mistake. We were going to post the documents but then we noticed personal info like addresses and tax ids in them and we were concerned about exposing Oru to trolls in real life. Oru will need to redact them and post later but then they exist and have convinced me to act. We will learn from this event and find solutions to keep it from happening again.

[Misk Brebran]

Good grief, I barely understand MY taxes so I couldnt even begin to contemplate an international tax code. Life is learning, applying and moving on in all aspects. Since I previously volunteered for about 11 years to a couple animal rescue organization, I completely understand the time, effort, sweat, fear, (blood and pain, in my case sometimes, lol) that can come into play. Kudos to ALL the staff for all you do so that we have an opprotunity to contribute to a community as unique as this and play a MMORPG (well THE MMORPG) we all love!! Thank you all and have a safe, happy holiday!

[Oru]

I'm sorry for casting aspersions or for any negative implications. But I saw this question elsewhere and I couldn't find an answer :

How many people in the project team have access to this accountant?

If it's more than one, can the other person(s) verify what Oru has said?

This accountant should have known the tax implications. And they should have had professional insurance to cover a mistake like this. That's what they are paid for.

I understand your concerns and i have updated the original post with the last tax balance sheet. Google translate loves this document but it is not hard to comprehend in this format either. Under 104 (general sales tax) you'll see a bunch of items dated back to 2018.01.01 (used them from 2015 to 2017, that's how it could be corrected), which were the missing taxes after Softlayer in Hungarian forints (HUF, 1 USD ~= 285 HUF). The other smaller amounts for 2018 are missing taxes for Slack.

Still struggling with redacting the tax office report because it was signed by them and it wasn't easy to remove that..

The whole situation is quite convoluted so i refrained from describing it to it's full extent to save readers time but i can explain it a little more now. So the main issue is that we were in contract with a US based company, bought services from them residing in Dallas TX and payed the bills in US dollars. Since they had an EU branch, seems they were obligated to bill us through this branch using the EU VAT system, which they indicated on the invoices with minuscule letters. None of us seen this of course but according to EU tax laws, this makes us, the buyers, responsible to report and occasionally pay the taxes. Reporting is one thing but the resolution whether we should pay taxes or not is quite complex. This consist of two things according to Hungarian taxation laws (yes there are local rules for this!). First you have to determine the place of fulfillment which in case of a tax-exempt company buying services is the site of the seller (Netherlands in case for Softlayer). That would have made Softlayer to pay local taxes and charge a higher bill but of course there is an exclusion for this in another section of the law which sais that in case of an electronic services, the place of fulfillment is the site of the seller. It describes several occasions for electronic services and while rented servers is not specifically listed, it is more or less evident that our case is included. The tax lawyer is still looking into this. Anyhow the story is still not over yet. So okay the place of fulfillment is Hungary but there is a 10k euro limit where you have to pay the 27% taxes from but you have to use a EUR to HUF conversion ratio fixed on a specific date (sometimes in 2016). So to determine this do we have to use the USD to HUF conversion ratio on this date or the date of the transaction? Or use the USD to EUR ratio? Anyhow, according to our interpretation we are only exceed a limit by a small amount, but the lawyer advised us to pay the taxes to get ahead of the possible fees (250% worst case) so we did not hesitate to pay because most likely the tax is due to be paid.

Now you think the story is over but once you'll see the tax office report and take the time to translate it, you will see they have raised another issue concerning your donations that could have made this situation even more complicated where we could require back taxes but made us pay taxes after the donations. Thankfully the lawyer took their claim apart, so i won't even describe it even further.

So tax issues are complicated. Company taxation are even more complicated. Company tax in Hungary is way more complicated thanks to legal uncertainty. Company taxes in Hungary over the EU system having a 3rd party contract to the US is beyond complicated as you can see. I can tell you that even the tax officers were scratching their heads along with the tax lawyer and still not completely sure about it..

[Bulba]

I am also a software developer and business owner. I'm not unfamiliar with how these things work but I'm not claiming to be an expert. I'm not trying to troll. I do like some conspiracy theories but I'm not trying to turn this into one.

I'm sorry if I come across as ungrateful or negative. I know I'm implying some nasty things about people but I am still reserving judgment. I don't believe a scam has occurred but people's circumstances can change fast and nobody is above temptation. If one person is holding the purse strings and the purse is in Hungary and nobody else can communicate with the accountant or the bank, you will get people like me asking questions like why isn't the accountants professional insurance covering this?.

Ultimately though, you're satisfied and I don't need to be satisfied because I'm not involved. And it would be presumptuous of me to make demands that I do be satisfied.

[Bulba]

Thanks for the clarification Oru.

[Praxi34]

I understand your concerns and i have updated the original post with the last tax balance sheet. Google translate loves this document but it is not hard to comprehend in this format either. Under 104 (general sales tax) you'll see a bunch of items dated back to 2018.01.01 (used them from 2015 to 2017, that's how it could be corrected), which were the missing taxes after Softlayer in Hungarian forints (HUF, 1 USD ~= 285 HUF). The other smaller amounts for 2018 are missing taxes for Slack.

Still struggling with redacting the tax office report because it was signed by them and it wasn't easy to remove that..

The whole situation is quite convoluted so i refrained from describing it to it's full extent to save readers time but i can explain it a little more now. So the main issue is that we were in contract with a US based company, bought services from them residing in Dallas TX and payed the bills in US dollars. Since they had an EU branch, seems they were obligated to bill us through this branch using the EU VAT system, which they indicated on the invoices with minuscule letters. None of us seen this of course but according to EU tax laws, this makes us, the buyers, responsible to report and occasionally pay the taxes. Reporting is one thing but the resolution whether we should pay taxes or not is quite complex. This consist of two things according to Hungarian taxation laws (yes there are local rules for this!). First you have to determine the place of fulfillment which in case of a tax-exempt company buying services is the site of the seller (Netherlands in case for Softlayer). That would have made Softlayer to pay local taxes and charge a higher bill but of course there is an exclusion for this in another section of the law which sais that in case of an electronic services, the place of fulfillment is the site of the seller. It describes several occasions for electronic services and while rented servers is not specifically listed, it is more or less evident that our case is included. The tax lawyer is still looking into this. Anyhow the story is still not over yet. So okay the place of fulfillment is Hungary but there is a 10k euro limit where you have to pay the 27% taxes from but you have to use a EUR to HUF conversion ratio fixed on a specific date (sometimes in 2016). So to determine this do we have to use the USD to HUF conversion ratio on this date or the date of the transaction? Or use the USD to EUR ratio? Anyhow, according to our interpretation we are only exceed a limit by a small amount, but the lawyer advised us to pay the taxes to get ahead of the possible fees (250% worst case) so we did not hesitate to pay because most likely the tax is due to be paid.

Now you think the story is over but once you'll see the tax office report and take the time to translate it, you will see they have raised another issue concerning your donations that could have made this situation even more complicated where we could require back taxes but made us pay taxes after the donations. Thankfully the lawyer took their claim apart, so i won't even describe it even further.

So tax issues are complicated. Company taxation are even more complicated. Company tax in Hungary is way more complicated thanks to legal uncertainty. Company taxes in Hungary over the EU system having a 3rd party contract to the US is beyond complicated as you can see. I can tell you that even the tax officers were scratching their heads along with the tax lawyer and still not completely sure about it..


Thanks for spending time explaining that! My head hurts but I get the jist! Your doing an amazing job!!! :)

[chayn]

Mistakes get made and they get corrected...... NP... I just hope this doesn't mean the project will get, like, double taxed (US and EU) from now till doomsday or something... 0_o

[nee2earth]

and i have updated the original post with the last tax balance sheet. .

Not sure how it's displaying on your end but i think when you edited your OP, it converted all your original text into GRAY font (makes it extremely difficult or impossible to read, depending upon the browser) .

Anyways no biggie but just figured i'd let you know.

Thanks again for the continued details & elaborations.

[Vlada]

Not sure how it's displaying on your end but i think when you edited your OP, it converted all your original text into GRAY font (makes it extremely difficult or impossible to read, depending upon the browser) .

I fixed it

[Oru]

Tax inspection report added.


I'm sorry if I come across as ungrateful or negative. I know I'm implying some nasty things about people but I am still reserving judgment. I don't believe a scam has occurred but people's circumstances can change fast and nobody is above temptation. If one person is holding the purse strings and the purse is in Hungary and nobody else can communicate with the accountant or the bank, you will get people like me asking questions like why isn't the accountants professional insurance covering this?.


I don't mind being questioned, was actually expecting these and i will try to answer them as best as i can. Regarding the insurance, there was none. The original accountant became way too expensive and when we had to switch late 2013, i found someone i knew doing it for third the price as a retired accountant who simply continued the process the way it was started without noticing the mistake. So we can go after the original accountant with a lawsuit but that would do more bad then good for sure.

Going to post the bank wires too once the monthly history is available.

[ljay1973]

I'm sorry for casting aspersions or for any negative implications. But I saw this question elsewhere and I couldn't find an answer :

How many people in the project team have access to this accountant?

If it's more than one, can the other person(s) verify what Oru has said?

This accountant should have known the tax implications. And they should have had professional insurance to cover a mistake like this. That's what they are paid for.


I've followed and interacted with this project since its earliest days. For quite a while now I've been unable to do much more than float in the far background of the forums. This has pulled me back to the keyboard!

I can honestly say that, in the past, there were members of the team who I wouldn't have trusted with the dead skin from the bottom of my feet, let alone money!
However, I personally feel complete trust in the current team to deliver on the goal in an honest manner.
I've watched on helpless as a very close friend lost their business they built from nothing through 20 years of hard, hard graft. lost their home, lost everything, all due to the incompetence of their tax accountant. Said accountant admitted fully to the mother of all f*** ups over a number of years, yet the accountant walked away with no repercussions while my friend lost everything. So please keep in mind that even a poor accountant will usually make sure their arse is covered but care not for their clients when it comes down to it.
Any negative reflection on the team here, from us on the outside, is baseless.


edit.....
oops, forgot to add
To the devs, support etc.. of SWGEMU. You do an amazing job, and will always have my gratitude.

[avimeso]

So you thought VAT wouldn't be applied to overseas buyers and your accountant didn't tell you otherwise? I'd sack the accountant. I think accountants are just glorified theives. They charge you a fortune for their service and as soon as something goes wrong they hold their hands in the air taking no responsibility.. Most goods and services from Australia are exempt from GST however GST is paid on all purchases by imported into Australia.

[Oru]

So you thought VAT wouldn't be applied to overseas buyers and your accountant didn't tell you otherwise? I'd sack the accountant. I think accountants are just glorified theives. They charge you a fortune for their service and as soon as something goes wrong they hold their hands in the air taking no responsibility.. Most goods and services from Australia are exempt from GST however GST is paid on all purchases by imported into Australia.

Maybe i'm just a stupid coder but i would expect to pay taxes at the point of sale, not leaving the responsibility on me to report and pay the taxes directly to the tax office.

I can hardly argue your point on accountants though.

[avimeso]

Maybe i'm just a stupid coder but i would expect to pay taxes at the point of sale, not leaving the responsibility on me to report and pay the taxes directly to the tax office.

I can hardly argue your point on accountants though.

Well 10% GST always is displayed on your invoice whenever you buy something here. Not sure what it like in US. I would of thought it would of been up to the company selling you a service in Europe to handle the tax by passing it on in their invoice but guess that isn't the case. Sounds like a stupid tax system they have there, expensive lesson to learn non the less.. Accountant really should have done his research, but just goes to show you cant rely on people to do their job. I've kinda learnt you always have to cover ones ***.

[longbow]

Transparency is always valued, keep up the great work!

[jarinalepetiot]

You're not a big GAFA, then error may occurs. Thank you for your job, thank you to SWGEmu teams.

[Oru]

Well 10% GST always is displayed on your invoice whenever you buy something here. Not sure what it like in US. I would of thought it would of been up to the company selling you a service in Europe to handle the tax by passing it on in their invoice but guess that isn't the case. Sounds like a stupid tax system they have there, expensive lesson to learn non the less.. Accountant really should have done his research, but just goes to show you cant rely on people to do their job. I've kinda learnt you always have to cover ones ***.

Let me show you some of the early invoices from 2013. I leave you to find the easter egg there:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/15AFpqyTFUrv7o4Zlr8rcDEsvP1rolrKL/view

(https://drive.google.com/file/d/15AFpqyTFUrv7o4Zlr8rcDEsvP1rolrKL/view)Not much clue until you really watch every line very closely. Besides that since they asked for the VAT id, i thought they figured we are tax-exempt and that is why 0% taxes are shown.

2 years later they realized the mess they did and made it more clear but still it was not too obvious:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1dNsKvzd1-Barpa6BF4wcsa4IPW_zXhqi/view
(https://drive.google.com/file/d/1dNsKvzd1-Barpa6BF4wcsa4IPW_zXhqi/view)

[avimeso]

can u msg me on discord just got a quick Q, i been reading about it. it seems very similar to GST.

[Vlada]

can u msg me on discord just got a quick Q, i been reading about it. it seems very similar to GST.

I very much doubt Oru can, but you can message Scurby there.

[avimeso]

I very much doubt Oru can, but you can message Scurby there. i always found talking to scurby like talking to a brick you never get a response.. I can email oru.

[Vlada]

i always found talking to scurby like talking to a brick you never get a response.. I can email oru.

That works

[Asifab19]

While we are grateful for the sudden influx of donations, I feel like i need say that this thread wasn't posted with that intent at all. Oru and the rest of the staff just wanted to keep the community in the loop. Yes we had some trouble with Hungarian tax authorities, yes we did have some unexpected expenses, but it was all covered and we're moving forward. I think LK said it best:

https://i.imgur.com/nBpffhF.jpg


On a more personal note, your concern, your dedication as well as your donations are humbling and deeply appreciated.

Thank you for being awesome.

Even though you like to Troll us on the forums most of the time Vlada, I think the donations are coming in because everyone would miss it haha.

To Oru.......**** happens man, I don't think anyone who has ever invested their time either helping or playing or even doing both on this project would be upset at you not being a master at Hungarian/US/EU taxation. While the staff is not asking for players to donate more I believe most will when they have the money. If you are still here either staff side or player side this game is probably one of the biggest passions you've had in your life time. While I was just a teenager when this game was live, I am now in my 30's being able to play it all again. No game has ever come close to this date at being as diverse in things you can do as SWG was.

If there is any future cost related issues with this project my personal opinion is bring them out to the community right away. I believe most of us that are still around now will do what ever we can to help keep this up and running.


Thank You to the founders, the current and retired staff for allowing us all to continue playing such an amazing game!

[Asifab19]

I'd like to throw one more thing into this post......Is it possible for you to keep us updated on how the project budget is currently doing now? I believe others like myself would like to know if we are still close to the red or if we are in the green now. I know some might not be able to contribute much at all. However if the project is still in trouble I'm sure the community would like to know so that we can hopefully help it out of trouble.


Thanks again for the years and countless hours of time spent in this project by the staff

[Mobyus1]

I'd like to throw one more thing into this post......Is it possible for you to keep us updated on how the project budget is currently doing now? I believe others like myself would like to know if we are still close to the red or if we are in the green now. I know some might not be able to contribute much at all. However if the project is still in trouble I'm sure the community would like to know so that we can hopefully help it out of trouble.


Thanks again for the years and countless hours of time spent in this project by the staff

According to the OP, it sounds like they saved enough to afford 1 month of expenditures after the tax issue was sorted. Since then, we’ve exceeded the monthly donation goal by about $800 (I believe). So by my math, we should still have 1 month and about $800/$2500 towards another. I think if we continue to exceed the monthly goal by a few hundred each month, we should be able to build a month or two buffer pretty easily.

[Vlada]

I'd like to throw one more thing into this post......Is it possible for you to keep us updated on how the project budget is currently doing now? I believe others like myself would like to know if we are still close to the red or if we are in the green now. I know some might not be able to contribute much at all. However if the project is still in trouble I'm sure the community would like to know so that we can hopefully help it out of trouble.


Thanks again for the years and countless hours of time spent in this project by the staff

We currently have 3,722.76 USD on our account

[Xnu]

I guess no one knew of the tiny little state of Oregon, which for all my understanding (as limited as it is), does not tax any of these kinds of assets.

Indeed, I worked for the SoS's office as a developer and no taxation of the kind exits. We have no sales tax, VAT or other taxation for services rendered of this kind.

Maybe why Amazon puts a data-center here in Tillamook.

[Surrena]

Maybe i'm just a stupid coder but i would expect to pay taxes at the point of sale, not leaving the responsibility on me to report and pay the taxes directly to the tax office.

I can hardly argue your point on accountants though.

Most accountant firms are just number punching people that put your bills into government system, most of them don't properly understand their own countries taxation, let alone the international taxes. Good accountant that knows international tax laws would probably cost a fortune, which is probably a no go for limited budget no profit swgemu.

Also are you personally liable for swgemu organization?

[Farelli]

I guess no one knew of the tiny little state of Oregon, which for all my understanding (as limited as it is), does not tax any of these kinds of assets.

Indeed, I worked for the SoS's office as a developer and no taxation of the kind exits. We have no sales tax, VAT or other taxation for services rendered of this kind.

Maybe why Amazon puts a data-center here in Tillamook.

I know of that tiny little state. First 18.5 years of my life spent there. Met Harry Truman just before the mountain erupted.

The cheese has always been good. We can get it in Rhode Island now.

[Livy2K]

Scurby is a saint. I will be donating 100% of my wages this month

[Oru]

Here is the last bit of information, the bank statement:

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1ShAhYHV86CvuBQCVTCWaltCybTC3CqHh


Most accountant firms are just number punching people that put your bills into government system, most of them don't properly understand their own countries taxation, let alone the international taxes. Good accountant that knows international tax laws would probably cost a fortune, which is probably a no go for limited budget no profit swgemu.

Also are you personally liable for swgemu organization?

Yeah costs can easily skyrocket and even then you might run into problems like this.

This is a limited liability company, however if you are being found guilty in wrongdoing, you gonna be fully responsible in all aspects.

[Bonowhemm Oplo]

Quite frankly, of all the things that could have gone wrong in the last few years (****** and whatnot), this is pretty minor. Still sucks though. Was actually thinking of re-installing now that I've got a gaff again and internet is a feasible prospect. No promises, I'm fixing tech for cash in hand right now and its pretty unreliable as income, but I'll try to kick the project my old subscription fee when I can.

[Hedge15]

I want to be clear, I know it's hard to understand the tax situation but its as real as death
This is the convincing part.

[PikiPunobi]

some legal representation would go a long way in this type of situation. perhaps there is a member of the community that can assist?

[dashbarron]

How much money are we still lacking to cover the taxes?

[lordkator]

How much money are we still lacking to cover the taxes?

It's been taken care of, this post is about transparency for the community.

If you're able to help a simple monthly subscription helps a lot, the more stable the donations the easier it is for us to plan.

[Mobyus1]

I don't believe we've missed our monthly goal since this post. However, I don't think we've been exceeding it by very much either. Hopefully we continue to slowly build up a buffer to protect against any more unforeseen expenditures.

[bigevil]

It's been taken care of, this post is about transparency for the community.

If you're able to help a simple monthly subscription helps a lot, the more stable the donations the easier it is for us to plan.

yepper....totally


I don't believe we've missed our monthly goal since this post. However, I don't think we've been exceeding it by very much either. Hopefully we continue to slowly build up a buffer to protect against any more unforeseen expenditures.

Small and steady wins the race too. :) I spend 50-60 bucks on a game monthly that i usually hate so dropping a few bucks a payday is a no brainer. I spend more time here anyway and have love it for years and years. :)

Good job to the community for showing some love!