2) The more rigid profession system we've switched to just doesn't lend itself to a skill system that's like what we had before.
Smed
The problem with this rigid profession system is that each and every profession has exactly the same skills - everyone has a snare, everyone has a double the damage of this hit, everyone has a heal, everyone has another snare .......... how is it a fun system if there is no real diferentiation between classes - who cares if I can be a boutny hunter if it is exactly the same as a smuggler - I am playing a clone game = no fun. Templates were actually fun because your char did not have to be exactly the same as everyone else in your class or in game - eq2 even you do not have to be same as everyone in your class because you can take different racial and class skills at certain points.
This game is just becoming less of a fun thinking man's game and more a just point and click and hope I hit the one I aimed at game where xp is non existent and quests are only for certain lvls then you are screwed
i started playing in october last year, it was extremly difficult to grasp CU...but dont get me wrong..i honestly LOVED learning new things about it everyday and finding out that.."OH COOL YOU CAN DO THAT???", during the CU alot seemed mysterious about the game...things i never heard about..items i knew nothing about, then when the NGE went live i started hearing about them all the time (due to nothing else to do) and it became boring..even when i hit lvl 80 in the CU..i would still be happy cause there was sumthing else to work for (JEDI), once i knew i unlocked it..i knew id be happy for months to come to grind out jedi as well as a new character slot.
loss of the templates gave us a 'loss of time' if you understand, the one way system knocked out alot of game playing time for us...i.e nothing really to do once you hit lvl 90..you cannot start a new template...or nothing to work for at all really. and also due to little content added to late (will get camped and when you have what your after...then your back to basics till sumthing NEW comes out)
Smed, why is it that the dev team and you are always avoiding this one question?
Will we ever see Clothing and Armor Attachments drop again? Crafters right now are getting screwed because they can't get any more experimentation points since they aren't dropping.
Someone from the dev team please answer this question.
Sadersam wrote: What i really like to know smed, is how do u feel about having people pay for beta. I mean really u know the game as it is right now is borked, and u are promising all these changes and fixes yet Soe is taking monthly subs for a game that is knowhere finished.
I know this is a loaded question, but I think the community deserves an answer. I know this is one of the things I've been upset about for a while.
"BZ helps ALL Rebels!" Melvar Anquist, Guildmaster BLINDZEBRA Hunters Guild [http://swg.blindzebra.com] "Who is the more foolish, the fool, or the fool who follows him?" -- Obi-Wan Kenobi Please drop all auction winnings off to any vendor at the BZ Crafter's House /waypoint 3185 -555 Xebec's Demise, Corellia.
Smed wrote: There is absolutely no truth to these rumors.
Why did I respond on FOH and not here? I just happened to see that thread last night... simple as that. At some point I can only deny nonsensical rumors on so many websites before it just plain becomes frustrating to me. It's the old "when did you stop kicking your puppy" trap..
I've also asked the Lucasarts folks to comment on this which you should see today some time (not sure when or where exactly).
I also want to say - I'm happy to discuss things that need to be done to make SWG better. What I will not do is respond to "go back to pre-NGE" threads or "please make 1 pre-nge server" threads. I've commented on those before.
Smed
So Smed, hows the 6 mounth plan comming, you know the one you told us about when you realesed the NGE on us and said 'give us 6 mounths to get it all nice and purty' well hows that going?
I think it's going as well as it can. The team is working on the next publish and I think it's fair to say with every new publish the game will be better. There are only so many hours in the day that the team can work and they've got it in overdrive making this game better.
Smed
Wise up. Your company needs to either allocate additional resources to the SWG project, or acquire new ones another way and fast. If you do not, I bet you will not have a project to work on any longer. Mark my words. What you are doing and have been doing is simply not working.
Per Synapse Elder Jedi - Council Member Order of Darkness -OD- Starting Date: July 1, 2003
The truth is the community morale won't improve until the game does. Communication can't fix this. Improvements to the game can. The fact is our communication has improved.. people don't neccessarily like the message is all. I get that. So do our community folks. My preference is that all the posts in the gameplay forum are discussing gameplay balance.. and in-game issues.. but they won't until we get the game to a baseline fun level. We're not there yet. We know that. We're working to fix it. There is no other answer.
Smed
Wow. An offical representative saying the game is hurting. This does give me hope. Not much. But some. We have seen in the past that what is said may not come to pass. Be aware Smed, the community will hold you to the above statement.
The SWG community has been voting with it's feet since the NGE came about. Either we end up being right about our ability to turn the ship around and make a game that's BETTER than it was before, or we were wrong and we fail. Either way we were losing subs before the NGE and believe it or not, we are losing them at a slower rate than before. I'm not going to pretend we didn't lose a bunch of subs from this. We did. And I don't think the game is where it needs to be yet to aquire new subs. But it's getting there with each and every publish.
At the end of the day there are a lot of people in this community that wonder why we did this? Why did we "deliberately" try and piss people off. Obviously that wasn't our intent. This is a business and we needed to improve the results of the business. Did we make a mistake? Maybe.. but only time is going to tell on that one. One thing is certain. We made a mistake with how we presented it to the community, and for that I'm sorry. I still think it was a needed thing though. It's not as simple as "you should have just fixed the things we were complaining about". That doesn't address the very real fact that what we had was a hardcore game that wasn't going to attract the mass audience that the Star Wars IP brings to the table.
Smed
We are all here to help this game improve a complete system change was not needed. Changing crafting, yes the starter kit, yes adding quest based system, yes but not a complete system change.
Message Edited by RKO on 03-24-200609:47 AM
I respectfully disagree with your position on this. The profession system had fundemental flaws that couldn't be corrected and still be able to both balance the game and add meaningful content that made each profession really matter and be differentiated from the others. Was crafting absolutely the most amazing part of the game? Probably IMO. Can it still be a major part of the game? Hell yes.. and it will be. BUT that needs to be balanced with the fact that adventuring and killing things needed to have meaningful rewards as well to reach a more mainstream audience. I really hope you can see this point even if you don't agree with it.
Smed
can you elaborate on this more, i dont understand what about the old profession system you found to be flawed. to me it just looked liek you wanted to simplify it. honestly smed i know your sticking with your guns but we are all telling you that it was a bad idea to simply the profession diversity. if your gonna stick by it, its on you but we are telling you. noone that played the old versions like this profession system more then the old. the old one was a better system. im not saying bring the whole thing back, but i just hope you guys have a positive compromise coming soon.
Sure - I'll elaborate.
What exactly was the difference between most of the combat professions? There really wasn't one unfortunately. Adding meaningful content for over 30 professions just wasn't something we were capable of. We bit off more than we could chew. Also, the fact that a person who had seen the movies won't know what most of those professions were presented a real problem for aquisition.
Smed
Smed there is primary proffession then the skills you choose to back it up. We can not choose the skills we want to go alone with our main proffession choice that is what we want. you guys need to understand why we want them.
WarStory
There are only five notes in the musical scale, but their variations are so many that that cannot all be heard. There are only five basic colors, but their variations are so many that they cannot all be seen. There are only five basic flavors, but their variations are so many they cannot all be tasted. There are only two kinds of charge in battle, the unorthodox surprise attack and the orthodox direct attack, but variations of the unorthodox and the orthodox are endless. The unorthodox and the orthodox give rise to each other, like a beginningless circle- The Art of War by Sun Tzu
Let me address your point head on. - SWG never attracted the size audience that the Star Wars license delivered in the first place. One of those reasons was combat wasn't exciting enough. We have done enough research on the people who quit or people that didn't purchase the game to know this is a hard, brutal cold fact. Could we have gone a different direction with the combat? Yes. Could we in the future change this direction? Yes. Do I think we will? No. Why? Because I don't believe that this will be an issue if we solve the other half of the equation - making the professions feel different... and making the content really exciting. If we asked you all to rank Combat vs. the loss of professions, I'm betting the loss of professions will "win" every time... I don't think the new combat style is the main thing that people are bothered by. It's the broad strokes changes to the rest of the game. What we've done is to get the game to a much more basic level that we can build on. I submit to you that if we achieve our other goals, this style of combat won't be an issue. The fact is the data we have suggest that for the people that DO sign up for the game they like the combat. For the people that don't, combat isn't the main issue we're losing them.
Smed
Just a small point here. Games like WoW, are advertised everywhere, I see it in the newspapers, in magazines, on the net. When I first started playing SWG, it wasn't from an ad, it was from another game. Not even an MMO game. That leaves me to believe that you were asking your community to be your advertisers for free instead of actually getting out there and letting the world know you existed. If you had placed some of that extra funding into advertising SWG instead of constantly changing it, you might have had a larger player base, instead of what you have now...which is a lack of trust from your community, and even from the potential new players. You've created a galaxy that is filled with bitter people, and guess who your new players meet and talk to when they first log in? By failing your community, your failing your game, no matter how great it becomes. If we're going to save SWG, you really need to start by at least compromising with your customers. If you just worry about making the game the way YOU want it, then only the ones like YOU will play it. There really does need to be something for everyone. YOU may not want to be Uncle Owen, but maybe someone else does.
Any chance you could put in a "good" word for me, in the Galatic Senate Program?
Message Edited by Altyrell on 03-24-200609:57 AM
Secret Poject? Where do people come up with this stuff. ALL developers on SWG are focused on the publish plan you saw. We were in the preliminary planning/design stages of a design for an expansion pack a few months back. When we saw how much work the live game needed and the reaction from both the community and the focus groups we dropped those plans. We can worry about that later.
Smed
Thank you to those who has reply saying that the whole thing with the "Secret Project" was from Swede... hopefully Smed will comment on the fact that Light has SHINED on the "Secret Project" subject...
(oh & Pres. Smed.... what about 2 - 6... any comments???)
please link to this post you're talking about and I'll try and find out what it refers to.
Call me selfish but i miss Pre-cu dearly. Do you think it's reasonable to say if by X amount of time the NGE doesnt meet it's "goals" we could go Pre-cu?
Greetings! Dont like the current combat system?
I have a solution!
Double click on the Launchpad Icon. Click "My Account". Enter your Password into the "password" field. Click "Manage Subscription". Click "Cancel Subscription". Than click into your window with the SWG Forums. Click "Logout".
00000000000000000000 Andross Xavier 00000000000000000000Rebel Jedi 00000000000000000000 00000000000000000000 'Motoko Kusanagi 00000000000000000000 Master Munitions 00000000000000000000 00000000000000000000Talca-Ra Inasto 00000000000000000000RETIRED 00000000000000000000 00000000000000000000 NTHR - SWG Division President 00000000000000000000 "Got himself a serious case of megalomania, huh?"
Virzo wrote: smed I dont understand, with an outcry like this, how do you not see we are upset. Im sorry, but I payed alot of money for the old game, and it changes. Yes you are losing subs, stop lying, We watch the servers slowly lose people. And the new people after level 30 get bored and leave. You dont have a game, its a hang out beta test.
maybe you would be so kind as to point out what I've lied about?
Smed
Well for one thing. You keep lying and saying that you are getting more subscribers now then before the NGE. Thats a lie. We all see the servers low populations now.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- - I support a rollback and keeping & balancing the old combat system. ...and making SWG a better place to be. Your voice counts!
I am still having a problem understanding why even in the interim a few PRECU servers are not available, you did it with EQ and EQ2, Most of my friends that left hate the NGE just as I do. I have actually cancelled 4 accounts and only have 2 more left active (which are just running out of time). What do you have to say about the supposed PRECU emulators that are coming down the pipe soon? I know a lot of people that will abandon this game for these new PRECU servers, do you not realize as a businessman that people are ready and willing to PAY for that(even though reportedly free). My top 3 complaints for this new system are as follows:
1) I hate the controls, plain and simple they are horrid. Like many of my friends I want precu controls with target lock. And I realize that your controls are for the most part copied from WOW but you are aware that they do in fact have target lock.
2) These base Professions offer no character diversity, I hate being the exact same as every other Jedi or medic out there.
3) Combat has been dumbed down...the turn based system of combat worked.
4) We were able to change professions when we got tired of one and still keep all of the badges because we didn't have to delete our account to make a new one.
5) And lastly, the xp rate for the xp rate is very poor. Because of the NGE I started playing WOW, they have done their homework on their system....it is balanced and far fewer bugs then SWG, but I would cancel WOW in a heart beat to return to SWG were it even half of what it was (also most of my friends have said teh same thing).
Many people are currently paying on their accounts but not actively playing in the hopes that SOE wiill see the light.
And one last thing to think about is that how your people implemented and communicate with us...the paying customers has a bigger impact on Sony then you might want to admit, as an example I have spent over $1500 dollars on products that prior to your implementation of teh NGE would have gone to Sony and now your competitors will get my money. I do realize that this is only a game, but it is the first game that I truely enjoyed, any future money that Sony gets from me if ever will be dependent on how you as a Manager deal with us the paying customers.
Thank you for your time and at least I am glad to see that you have the intestinal fortitude to stand in the firing line.
Jobo
USMC
___This login Hijacked by Jobo due to bannination on my forums priveledges due to me being naughty_______ Mojoo Founder of the CULT Mayor of Sarlacc City- POI Capital of Tatooine! Beta 3 Tester
What exactly was the difference between most of the combat professions? There really wasn't one unfortunately. Adding meaningful content for over 30 professions just wasn't something we were capable of. We bit off more than we could chew. Also, the fact that a person who had seen the movies won't know what most of those professions were presented a real problem for aquisition.
Smed
You're having a hard enough time adding content for 9, none of the entertainer or crafter items with quests work, and the other 7 profs only 2/3 work.
Virzo wrote: smed I dont understand, with an outcry like this, how do you not see we are upset. Im sorry, but I payed alot of money for the old game, and it changes. Yes you are losing subs, stop lying, We watch the servers slowly lose people. And the new people after level 30 get bored and leave. You dont have a game, its a hang out beta test.
maybe you would be so kind as to point out what I've lied about?
Smed
ok... you said that there wasn't a "Secret Project"... yet Swede said that he and several other were being reassigned to work on a Project, that he couldn't discuss....
d Lord Vincent Takaab Blackbird (Altyrell) ~MEOW~.
