Well, I was writing up a report on Machiavelli and was looking for something more entertaining to do when I stumbled across the thread about carbines and PVP. I don't consider myself the best, but I do think I am one of the best carbine users on bloodfin. I'm going to be giving some brief information on templates, and then go into some tactics that you can use in actual PVP combat, mainly if you are ALONE (yes, I said alone).
First of all, in order to be successful what-so-ever in PVP with carbines, you will need the BH carbines tree (BH 0400). This gives you some very potent knockdowns [Fire, and Underhand] and sticky states [confusion shot]. What this will allow you to do is invest some points in medic and pistoleer [I suggest medic 0040 and pistoleer 0040. This template also offers you the option to get BH 3400, letting you hunt jedi, or pistoleer 0043, but in my opinion this template is more suitable to a support role (medic/DPS/low defenses) so going investigation may not be very helpful]. Carbineers in general have very low defenses, so stacking with pistoleer can be important. (NOTE: Dodge will NOT work for carbines, so don't even bother with 4000 pistoleer). Another nice template is Master Bounty Hunter and Master Carbineer. I suggest that for this you use novice medic to help you with healing. The advantage of master bounty hunter is spray shot; a carbines special which stuns, blinds, and dizzies -- each equally sticky and highly potent. The problem with this is that you lose the pistoleer defenses, however, combining templates might work also (for example, I am right now MBH/Carbineer 0404/pistoleer 0043/novice brawler). Test different templates and find out which one is best for you. If you have one that you like that is for PVP, post it here for others to see.
Now, on to tactics. The very first thing you want to do in a fight is to land as many states as you possibly can. For jedi, spray shot is almost a must, as the blind will reduce saber block in conjunction with the stun. For regular players, it makes them easier to hit, and makes you more difficult to hit. Dizzy of course is the one that we're looking for, because in a pure DPS match carbineers have a lot of trouble (especially without any medic). If you have intimidate, use it now. Always open the fight with your state shots, since intimidate does not work in the opening combat phase. Once you have achieved all your states, I suggest underhand shot. Though fire KD and underhand shot are almost similar in their knockdown potency, I find underhand to be much better (assuming that you followed the first step and landed the dizzy). If your target is grouped, right now is when you activate burst run. The initial confusion has dispersed and now everyone is targeting you. All you have to do is run in circles around your target using crippling shot, or spray shot if they are using the stand/heal state exploit. Carbineers are often looked at as a support profession, but their DPS and battlefield control say otherwise. However, if you are in a group, have your melee stacker attack first and open up right after him with the same tactics stated above. Hopefully in the confusion everyone will attack the stacker and you can strike the target while they aren't paying attention. Then, coordinate to pick off one target at a time with your melee companion, starting with other melee, and working your way to ranged.
The most difficult thing for carbineers is most definately the fact that if you are hit first, there is a large possibilty that you're toast. That is why it is important to always stay OUTSIDE large cities to maintain battlefield control and awareness. Surprise is an element that YOU want to have, not your enemy. It's important to keep your map up at all times while overt to locate any red triangles and position to surprise them before they can see you. Also, intelligence reports from people inside a town are invaluable when it comes to PVP. Here is a first person example of what I'm talking about:
I approached bestine overt on my swoop. Instead of charging into town recklessly, I asked for intelligence from my non-overt guild mates on enemy activity. I get the report that there are four overt rebels outside the starport. So I move in to town just enough that I can see the red triangles on my radar, then pull back so they don't see me on theirs. I monitor them until I see them moving towards the starport. I follow them in and notice a swoop parked outside the star port door. I don't blow it, that will give me away. Instead, I wait for the first member of their force to board the shuttle, run out the door, and engage the one who is still running towards the ticket collector. By the time I get the TEF the majority of the group is already boarded and on their way to who knows where. Only two of them remain on planet, one of them that i'm attacking, the other waiting to talk to the ticket collector. I tripple state, intimidate, and knock down the first target, then target the guy at the ticket collector, tripple state and knock down him (no intimidate, he'll come later). I then analyze his weapon choice, and adjust mine (Melee -- laser. Ranged -- DXR6) and proceed accordingly by using crippling shot or spray shot (depending whether he can heal states or not). After I DB him, I go back to the second target and spam spray shot. Once his states wear off, he is stated again to keep him on the ground. Then I use crippling shot until he's dead. Just got two more kills.
Unrealistic? No. A similar situation happened to me just the other day. Patience is key when it comes to playing a carbineer, and anything more then a 2 on 1 fight is futile. It's too difficult to keep 3 people stated and on the ground if even one of them has doctor. If you are in a group with other players, your group using your skill could take on another force twice your size. The ability to tripple state multiple targets with area shot 2, and then knocking them down. The disadavantage of charge shot 2 is that a missed knockdown can be a big hassle, because if you knockdown a single target after he is already knocked down, that target will stand right back up again. It might even be more effective to just go through each target individually knocking them down using tab to cycle through them.
What poses the greatest thread to carbineers?
EVERYTHING! Though this is true, it was more of a joke. Combat medics are very dangerous, and so are rifleman/docs. You could slug it out for 30 minutes with a rifleman/doc and make absolutely no progress even with the very best template. TKAs will be your easiest fight because they are so easy to state and knockdown. Stackers will pose difficulty, but keep at it with posture changes and knockdowns, and the states shouldn't be a problem. Also, stackers can't usually afford doctor, so you're safe there. If you ever run into a doctor/combat medic/rifleman -- Run up a hill using burst run. the rifleman will not be able to catch up and you can escape to safety. After you peace, summon your bike and continue running up hill for as long as possible. It is very likely that your enemy will also be summoning his own vehicle so it's important to maintain a lead over him for as long as possible, eventually, he will give up and drive away.
That about covers everything, if you have something to add, please, say so, and I will edit it into the message!
Well, I was writing up a report on Machiavelli and was looking for something more entertaining to do when I stumbled across the thread about carbines and PVP. I don't consider myself the best, but I do think I am one of the best carbine users on bloodfin. I'm going to be giving some brief information on templates, and then go into some tactics that you can use in actual PVP combat, mainly if you are ALONE (yes, I said alone).
First of all, in order to be successful what-so-ever in PVP with carbines, you will need the BH carbines tree (BH 0400). This gives you some very potent knockdowns [Fire, and Underhand] and sticky states [confusion shot]. What this will allow you to do is invest some points in medic and pistoleer [I suggest medic 0040 and pistoleer 0040. This template also offers you the option to get BH 3400, letting you hunt jedi, or pistoleer 0043, but in my opinion this template is more suitable to a support role (medic/DPS/low defenses) so going investigation may not be very helpful]. Carbineers in general have very low defenses, so stacking with pistoleer can be important. (NOTE: Dodge will NOT work for carbines, so don't even bother with 4000 pistoleer). Another nice template is Master Bounty Hunter and Master Carbineer. I suggest that for this you use novice medic to help you with healing. The advantage of master bounty hunter is spray shot; a carbines special which stuns, blinds, and dizzies -- each equally sticky and highly potent. The problem with this is that you lose the pistoleer defenses, however, combining templates might work also (for example, I am right now MBH/Carbineer 0404/pistoleer 0043/novice brawler). Test different templates and find out which one is best for you. If you have one that you like that is for PVP, post it here for others to see.
Now, on to tactics. The very first thing you want to do in a fight is to land as many states as you possibly can. For jedi, spray shot is almost a must, as the blind will reduce saber block in conjunction with the stun. For regular players, it makes them easier to hit, and makes you more difficult to hit. Dizzy of course is the one that we're looking for, because in a pure DPS match carbineers have a lot of trouble (especially without any medic). If you have intimidate, use it now. Always open the fight with your state shots, since intimidate does not work in the opening combat phase. Once you have achieved all your states, I suggest underhand shot. Though fire KD and underhand shot are almost similar in their knockdown potency, I find underhand to be much better (assuming that you followed the first step and landed the dizzy). If your target is grouped, right now is when you activate burst run. The initial confusion has dispersed and now everyone is targeting you. All you have to do is run in circles around your target using crippling shot, or spray shot if they are using the stand/heal state exploit. Carbineers are often looked at as a support profession, but their DPS and battlefield control say otherwise. However, if you are in a group, have your melee stacker attack first and open up right after him with the same tactics stated above. Hopefully in the confusion everyone will attack the stacker and you can strike the target while they aren't paying attention. Then, coordinate to pick off one target at a time with your melee companion, starting with other melee, and working your way to ranged.
The most difficult thing for carbineers is most definately the fact that if you are hit first, there is a large possibilty that you're toast. That is why it is important to always stay OUTSIDE large cities to maintain battlefield control and awareness. Surprise is an element that YOU want to have, not your enemy. It's important to keep your map up at all times while overt to locate any red triangles and position to surprise them before they can see you. Also, intelligence reports from people inside a town are invaluable when it comes to PVP. Here is a first person example of what I'm talking about:
I approached bestine overt on my swoop. Instead of charging into town recklessly, I asked for intelligence from my non-overt guild mates on enemy activity. I get the report that there are four overt rebels outside the starport. So I move in to town just enough that I can see the red triangles on my radar, then pull back so they don't see me on theirs. I monitor them until I see them moving towards the starport. I follow them in and notice a swoop parked outside the star port door. I don't blow it, that will give me away. Instead, I wait for the first member of their force to board the shuttle, run out the door, and engage the one who is still running towards the ticket collector. By the time I get the TEF the majority of the group is already boarded and on their way to who knows where. Only two of them remain on planet, one of them that i'm attacking, the other waiting to talk to the ticket collector. I tripple state, intimidate, and knock down the first target, then target the guy at the ticket collector, tripple state and knock down him (no intimidate, he'll come later). I then analyze his weapon choice, and adjust mine (Melee -- laser. Ranged -- DXR6) and proceed accordingly by using crippling shot or spray shot (depending whether he can heal states or not). After I DB him, I go back to the second target and spam spray shot. Once his states wear off, he is stated again to keep him on the ground. Then I use crippling shot until he's dead. Just got two more kills.
Unrealistic? No. A similar situation happened to me just the other day. Patience is key when it comes to playing a carbineer, and anything more then a 2 on 1 fight is futile. It's too difficult to keep 3 people stated and on the ground if even one of them has doctor. If you are in a group with other players, your group using your skill could take on another force twice your size. The ability to tripple state multiple targets with area shot 2, and then knocking them down. The disadavantage of charge shot 2 is that a missed knockdown can be a big hassle, because if you knockdown a single target after he is already knocked down, that target will stand right back up again. It might even be more effective to just go through each target individually knocking them down using tab to cycle through them.
What poses the greatest thread to carbineers?
EVERYTHING! Though this is true, it was more of a joke. Combat medics are very dangerous, and so are rifleman/docs. You could slug it out for 30 minutes with a rifleman/doc and make absolutely no progress even with the very best template. TKAs will be your easiest fight because they are so easy to state and knockdown. Stackers will pose difficulty, but keep at it with posture changes and knockdowns, and the states shouldn't be a problem. Also, stackers can't usually afford doctor, so you're safe there. If you ever run into a doctor/combat medic/rifleman -- Run up a hill using burst run. the rifleman will not be able to catch up and you can escape to safety. After you peace, summon your bike and continue running up hill for as long as possible. It is very likely that your enemy will also be summoning his own vehicle so it's important to maintain a lead over him for as long as possible, eventually, he will give up and drive away.
That about covers everything, if you have something to add, please, say so, and I will edit it into the message!
Message Edited by showmercy on 10-21-200403:25 PM
Thank you so much Showmercy, but in your post, BH carbine is a MUST. Now, I am planning to be a CM/Carbineer, how would you rate my template, can i still be effective in PvP?
"I ain't crazy, i'm just metally un-balance. After all, I am one of the few, the proude, the neglected, I AM A SMUGGLER."
Some good info there, showmercy. It relies too much on the BH carbine line, which is in actual fact NOT the best Carbineer PvP template you can pick up, but it's a great start for those who like the BH benefits.
Also worth checking out a post I made sometime back about Carbine Tactics, which explains our role in applying states and posture changes.
DHorse, Carbineer/CM is a good PvP support profession, provided you're able to speedcap your carbines with +25 carbine speed in tapes, krayt tissues, speed slices/powerups, etc. I think Penne who also plays on Bloodfin is a Carbineer/part-CM, and he's in one of the best Bloodfin PvP PAs, and a nasty person to come accross.
DHorse, Carbineer/CM is a good PvP support profession, provided you're able to speedcap your carbines with +25 carbine speed in tapes, krayt tissues, speed slices/powerups, etc. I think Penne who also plays on Bloodfin is a Carbineer/part-CM, and he's in one of the best Bloodfin PvP PAs, and a nasty person to come accross.
Thank you Admiral
"I ain't crazy, i'm just metally un-balance. After all, I am one of the few, the proude, the neglected, I AM A SMUGGLER."
I believe penne (the LEADER of the best PvP PA on Bloodfin) quit a long time ago, but I can't confirm he was carbineer/CM. However, he also spent 25 million dollars buying a powerful DOT carbine and relied very heavily on it. He also used rifles however, so the chance that he used both carbines, rifles, and CM is very slim.
If you want my honest opinion, I think that Rifleman/CM is probably the best you can do. Why? Toss in a couple mind poisons, and hit them with a high powered jawa or T21, and they are toast. The reason that carbineer is not usually the first choice is because the only pool we can target specifically is action, and poorly at best. Action is easily healed, and because carbineer also offers low defenses, mixing it with CM which also has poor defenses is asking for death.
And believe me, I know that carbineer doesn't need BH carbines, however, my post was more directed as one on one combat. Carbineer it self is great if you have the money for attachments/good weapons (I have both already, but still keep BH). However, it's not very good for a one on one fight.
I thought I had the PvP info linked in the FAQ.....I must apologize for not getting all the links done.....
And I really like having varied opinions with varied templates discussed and linked for all to see. There is no single way to play Carbineer in PvP or even PvE so the more we all share the better we all become.
Iebas Feania Former Correspondent of the Former Profession, CARBINEER
