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Re: Hey Eclipse - STOP SELLING/WASTING GOOD SPACE LOOT!   [ Edited ]
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KaylBreinhar
Jedi
Posts: 7797
Registered: 10-08-2003


KaylBreinhar
PA: Imperial Coalition of Eclipse: -ICE-
Server: Eclipse

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Okay, evidently some people still don't know how REing works, exactly.

Quite frankly, I don't blame you - it took me about a week to get the particulars down as well.

Simply put, REing is the process of mating similar parts together to create a part that excels (albeit not by an overly appreciable amount) over the stats of their original parts. Think of them as Frankensteinian Ship Components.

The Newbie's Guide to REing

1. Starting at the very beginning, each component (unless they're crafted) has both an equipment (i.e. usage/certification) level and a reverse engineering level. 9 times out of 10, this level is the same, yet sometimes there are components which have non-matching levels. The Mandalmotors DXR-4 Reactor is a good example, as it's a Level 4 Cert reactor with an RE level of 5.

-----

2. Once you find a piece of loot that seems to be worth REing, you have to go about finding mates for it. One thing you should ask yourself when you find one of these rare pieces of good/decent loot is - "what should I look to improve here?"

If, for instance, the item in question is an L4 reactor with a 13500 gen rate, it's pretty safe to say you're not going to find much better. HOWEVER, maybe the reactor weighs 6k. In which case, you should probably look for a lower mass L4 in the low 4000s on the bazaar and vendor search (as far as I know, no one has officially mapped a full looted component list - SOE SHOULD, but probably won't). After finding a piece with low mass and high regen, you MIGHT want to go about looking for one with high hp/armor to give you a little protection in PvE from being disabled, but it's optional. To be nice, for the one "junk" reactor you need, hit up the bazaar for a real piece of crap. Don't use another 13k L4 as your filler simply because you had it lying around.

Also, there is no shoving a smaller peg into a bigger hole in REing. You can't pair an RE8 with an RE10 - only RE8s will mate with RE8s and vice versa for RE10s. If this were allowed, you'd have 5000-damage L10s weighing 900 mass. It doesn't work this way.

Also, if you see a component on the bazaar which DOESN'T have an RE level at the bottom, it's not bugged - it has already been REed. I mention this because if you're new, you're not looking for this, and you'll THINK you've found a KICKASS part, only to be told by a SW that you wasted your money because the part has already been REed and can't be used AGAIN.

Here's another misconception - REing is not reversible - it is PERMANENT WITH A CAPITAL **PER** - there are no "oopsies" - once a SW clicks "OK" on the RE tool, it's FINAL. There IS NO GOING BACK, which is why I'm hoping to convey a sense of finality here.

And this myth still pervades - YOU DO NOT NEED EXACT SIMILAR BRAND ITEMS TO RE. Have two RE2 Caps of different brands? Go wild.

-----

3. Probably the biggest question revolving around REing besides wanting to know the particulars, is people wanting to know just how much they'll benefit from it.

REing improves a component by a small average, either increasing or decreasing a stat (depending on which direction is beneficial) by 1-6%, depending on the RE level of the component.

As for the brass tacks, the bonuses are as follows: RE=1%, RE2&3=2%, RE4&5=3%, RE6&7=4%, RE8&9=5%, RE10=6%. These can be found using any calculator with a memory function (even though memory is only useful for stats involving a subtraction of any sort).

Obviously stats like mass and Energy Per Shot (EPS) on weapons adjust downward, while damage, regen, and effectiveness stats adjust upward. The only stat which is NOT affected by REing (and hasn't been for some time), is Reactor Drain. So, once again, when looking to RE a part that will drain power, look for the lowest you can find.

----

And just because I want to hammer this home...here's a case study on a relatively complicated part - an L8 blaster.

Let's assume you have one of the L8 reward blasters (either the Borstel Disruptor or Incom 'Tri-Cannon'). This weapon will cover your hp/armor (when new), both min/max damage, and EPS. That's five stats you no longer have to worry about out of the four remaining on the weapon.

So, in an easier-to-read format:

HP - Covered by the Borstel/Incom (around 700hp when brand new)
Armor - Covered by the Borstel/Incom (likewise)
Drain - Theoretical #1 1800.0 drain L8/RE8
Min Damage - Covered by the Borstel/Incom (usually around 2387)
Max Damage - Covered by the Borstel/Incom (usually around 3692)
Eff vs. Shields - Theoretical #2 .650VS
Eff vs. Armor - Theoretical #3 .660VA
Energy Per Shot - Covered by the Borstel/Incom (typically a nice cap-friendly 14.1)
Refire - Theoretical #4 .395 (this is about as good as an L8 gets)

Using these figures, modifying them by a 5% (.05 on a calculator, not .5) bonus (either up or down, depending on the stat), we would end up with a final product of 735 armor/hp, 1800 drain (remember this is bugged), around 2506-3876 damage, .682VS/.693VA, 13.4EPS, and about a .371-.372 refire. Not fabulous - but it blends the best of five worlds.

Okay, in total, we have five weapons to craft what we'd WANT this weapon to turn into. We still need three. In most cases, you'd go out and find three L8 junkers...but...

...if you're "artistic," you might want to go out and find two L8 junkers and one brand which creates a specific firing or shot-type effect. There is a post that describes these shot types in greater detail, and there are enough variations that I don't know them by heart. When you do find this "pretty" part, make sure you tell the SW you want it put in the tool first.

Hopefully this clears up some confusion and further waste of good loot.

Message Edited by KaylBreinhar on 06-16-2005 04:22 AM

Death doesn't fly a JSF anymore...he flies a Gallente Thorax in EVE Online
06-11-2005 08:04 PM  

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Re: Hey Eclipse - STOP SELLING/WASTING GOOD SPACE LOOT!
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lowlylowlycook
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Posts: 26
Registered: 06-04-2005



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OK, I love this post.  Now after some panic and a thread in shipwright created just to track this thing down I have it bookmarked.  I expect sony will break the link momentarily.  For handy reference I turned Kayl's knowledge in to a table sorted by compontent type rather than RE level.   I've decided to go ahead and share it despite the fact I'm sure there are typos/omissions/errors and the forum borks the formating.  I hope that Kayl or some other experts can fill in info that is probably obvious to them but not to a newb like me. 
 
In any case this thread should be stickied somewhere prominent for both pilots and SW.
 
Reactors__________________________________________________________
1 12k gen, ??? mass
2 ??? gen, 1.2k mass 
3 ??? gen, 4k mass
4 ??? gen, 4k mass
8 30k gen,  24k mass
 Kuat RCT-Z
 
Capacitors_________________________________________________________
2 energy 950, regen 38, drain ???, mass ???
4 energy 1000,    regen 40,    drain 750,    mass ???
 gallant, gallofree, corellian, qualdex
6 energy 1150, regen 46, drain 700, mass 9k
 Mon Calamari MH,Qualdex HCA,Qualdex Conservator
10   energy 1.3k, regen 50, drain 1k, mass 43k

Engines ___________________________________________________________
2 speed ??, YPR 60,
4 speed 68, YPR 62,
6 speed 79, YPR 67, drain 1.3k, mass 9.3k
8 speed 88, PYR 70, drain 1.5k, mass 25k
10 speed 90, YPR 75, drain ????, mass  45k
 
Boosters___________________________________________________________
4 mass 3k, burn 145
 Mandel Motors M, Novaldex Hypernova,Sienar Special Ion

Armor______________________________________________________________
4  600hp, 2k mass
 SFS light military druasteel
6 1300hp,  6k mass
 Corellian Triplate
8 1900hp, 13 kmass
 nym's reward
 
Weapons_____________________________________________________________
5 2k drain, 1k-1.5k dam, .6 eff,
6  2k drain, 1.7k-2.5k dam, .7 eff, 10k mass,
7 3k drain, 1.9k-3.0k dam, .6 eff, 14k mass, eps 24
8 2k drain,   .64eff, 27k mass,
 Borstel Disruptor
10 2k drain, 2.6k-4k dam, .7eff, 45kmass, eps 30
Sheilds
7 1.8k hp, 2.2k drain, 17k mass,
 Protect O net,  
8   2.2k drain, 28k mass,  14 regen
10 2.5k hp, 2.0k drain, 40k mass,  16 regen
06-13-2005 06:45 AM  

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Re: Hey Eclipse - STOP SELLING/WASTING GOOD SPACE LOOT!   [ Edited ]
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KaylBreinhar
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Posts: 7797
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KaylBreinhar
PA: Imperial Coalition of Eclipse: -ICE-
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Nice to see this is being used for the proper context rather than, "hey, it looks like that guy's got his space sh*t together - I'll pay him a pittance to grind my T3/4/Vette mission for me! He's a pilot anyway, so he's probably used to getting f**k all in return for his investment and time!"

Message Edited by KaylBreinhar on 06-14-2005 04:58 AM

Death doesn't fly a JSF anymore...he flies a Gallente Thorax in EVE Online
06-14-2005 01:55 AM  

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Re: Hey Eclipse - STOP SELLING/WASTING GOOD SPACE LOOT!
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KaylBreinhar
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KaylBreinhar
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And with that last post I perfectly illustrate why I could never be Pilot Correspondent.

I'd be the R. Lee Ermey (not the toned-down "Mail Call" version), the "Gunnery Sargeant Hartman" of Correspondents.

Death doesn't fly a JSF anymore...he flies a Gallente Thorax in EVE Online
06-14-2005 01:58 AM  

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Re: Hey Eclipse - STOP SELLING/WASTING GOOD SPACE LOOT!
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Rhu
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Registered: 07-21-2003


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This is why I refuse to let myself become famous for anything.
 
Though maybe if I made myself into a famous post sniper/troll I could assure that people would clear a path for me wherever I go.
 
"Oh no! Here comes that green alien guy whose name I can't remember but really irritates me, all the same! Let's get out of his way before he makes me puke again!"
 
Always seemed better to me than the possible (because people saying stuff like the below either are not sincere, get creepy on you, cause others to notice you and insult you just for being famous, or get really, really creepy on you):
 
"Ye gads! It's the HERO! Can I have a drop of your sweat, HERO? Maybe you can spare me some credits? Could you show me how to be like you?"
 
Though my favorite is:
 
"Rhu who? Oh, I think I did something with him once. He was a bit of a smartass, but mostly not offensive."
06-14-2005 02:46 AM  

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Re: Hey Eclipse - STOP SELLING/WASTING GOOD SPACE LOOT!
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Waarangel
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Wanted to add a small sidenote to Jotun's wonderful RE guide. Not that it has any bearing on actual efficiency, but for some that want effectiveness AND visual style, remember to try out your individual pieces on your ship first to see which one you think looks best.

That's right, many different manufacturers of the same components actually look different visually on your ship. Like that sleek tapered engine on your M22 Krayt or that big honking, four finned, wide arse monster? It's all about personal preference.

Once you find the one that looks right to you, jot down its name. When taking it in to a SW for RE, ask them to use that one first, as the first one used in the RE determines the final visual look of your component.

Keep the good posts coming Jotun.

PS. Rhu, you are famous.

N'VARRAWREN®
Unabunko Kwee Kunee Ulwan
06-14-2005 03:16 AM  

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Re: Hey Eclipse - STOP SELLING/WASTING GOOD SPACE LOOT!   [ Edited ]
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Zhagadska
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Waarangel wrote:

Wanted to add a small sidenote to Jotun's wonderful RE guide. Not that it has any bearing on actual efficiency, but for some that want effectiveness AND visual style, remember to try out your individual pieces on your ship first to see which one you think looks best.

That's right, many different manufacturers of the same components actually look different visually on your ship. Like that sleek tapered engine on your M22 Krayt or that big honking, four finned, wide arse monster? It's all about personal preference.

Once you find the one that looks right to you, jot down its name. When taking it in to a SW for RE, ask them to use that one first, as the first one used in the RE determines the final visual look of your component.

Keep the good posts coming Jotun.

PS. Rhu, you are famous.




excellent point..what's the point of being able kick @$$ in space if you can't look good doing it?
 
i got my bellebullb...bulbubba..bellbubbulbalab...
 
my grievious fighter decked out in not only effective gear, but gear that makes it look really cool!
 
 
 
btw, can the Nym's Relic rewards be RE'd?  i got em last night but haven't paid a visit to my PA's shipwright yet.  it'd be cool if they can be improved on even more.

Message Edited by Zhagadska on 06-14-2005 06:37 PM

InVictus Kell - Smuggler for Life
Started: Beta 2
Retired : 1-27-06

It's been fun...
06-14-2005 04:36 PM  

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Re: Hey Eclipse - STOP SELLING/WASTING GOOD SPACE LOOT!
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KaylBreinhar
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KaylBreinhar
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I'm SO glad someone finally did this...a DPS calculator for space weapons that factors in refire.

Death doesn't fly a JSF anymore...he flies a Gallente Thorax in EVE Online
06-14-2005 06:17 PM  

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Re: Hey Eclipse - STOP SELLING/WASTING GOOD SPACE LOOT!   [ Edited ]
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KaylBreinhar
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KaylBreinhar
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And yes, the Nym's Starmap rewards CAN be REed.

Every single part he gives has the chance of being exceptional pieces - the L8/RE8 engine and L10/RE10 blaster at the end are arguably the best, though. The L8 engine is the only way nowadays that you're going to get a chance at a 9x.x L8. The L10 can get as high as 4600+ as well as having a respectable .7xx vs. Shields value.

The L8 armor pieces should make a POB owner (or possibly heavy-fighter flier) happy.

The L8/RE7 shield, if you do enough legwork, should RE quite nicely as well and provide a nice little traveling piece if you decide to do other squadrons, since having a good and low-cost shield drain-wise is VERY nice for Tier 3 missions. 1900ish SW-made shields are nice, but I'd rather have 1800hp @ 2000-2200 drain than 1900hp at 3400 drain. It'd mean the difference between being able to use one and two blasters, most likely.

Message Edited by KaylBreinhar on 06-16-2005 04:33 AM

Death doesn't fly a JSF anymore...he flies a Gallente Thorax in EVE Online
06-16-2005 01:28 AM  

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Re: Hey Eclipse - STOP SELLING/WASTING GOOD SPACE LOOT!   [ Edited ]
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KaylBreinhar
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KaylBreinhar
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Quite possibly a post that could end up being the most valuable to REing EVER...

...a nearly complete listing of all loot parts.

Of course, I knew most of this by heart - that's how I found good stuff. Now anyone with the paper to copy, paste and print will know where to look.

EDIT: Christ, he even added weapon effect details. Show this guy some love.

Message Edited by KaylBreinhar on 06-16-2005 04:36 AM

Death doesn't fly a JSF anymore...he flies a Gallente Thorax in EVE Online
06-16-2005 01:31 AM  

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Re: Hey Eclipse - STOP SELLING/WASTING GOOD SPACE LOOT!
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Zhagadska
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Zhagadska
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yeah, the engine, the gun and the armor were very nice.

 

the shield surprised me since i've gotten better crafted ones, much less looted ones.

 

but i'll see what they look like when i get my Firespray or YT going, afterall, looking good is what's really important

InVictus Kell - Smuggler for Life
Started: Beta 2
Retired : 1-27-06

It's been fun...
06-16-2005 09:24 AM  

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Re: Hey Eclipse - STOP SELLING/WASTING GOOD SPACE LOOT!
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KundoJet
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OK, weird RE question... I've got a number of components with a component level of X, but an RE level of Y.  Mostly this is crappy Lvl 10 components (like capacitors) with an RE of 5 and no good stats to speak of.  But some of them are Lvl 6 components with an RE of 8 (I think that's right, I can't get ingame to check in more detail).  How do these work?  With what components should I mate them?
 
And thanks again, Jotun - awesome thread, and you're right - you'd never make Corr, sadly.  Perhaps we should breed you with a Caamasi? 

Celebriel Inle
Black Rabbit
06-16-2005 10:07 AM  

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Re: Hey Eclipse - STOP SELLING/WASTING GOOD SPACE LOOT!
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Waarangel
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You need to match them with RE levels. I am not 100% sure if it is cert level AND RE level, but i know it is RE level for certain. Aren't I helpful out of game?

N'VARRAWREN®
Unabunko Kwee Kunee Ulwan
06-16-2005 10:11 AM  

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Re: Hey Eclipse - STOP SELLING/WASTING GOOD SPACE LOOT!
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KundoJet
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Waarangel wrote:
You need to match them with RE levels. I am not 100% sure if it is cert level AND RE level, but i know it is RE level for certain. Aren't I helpful out of game?



Heh - about as helpful as I am, hon.    But hey - you're supposed to be napping.    /drug 'Varra

Celebriel Inle
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06-16-2005 10:17 AM  

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Re: Hey Eclipse - STOP SELLING/WASTING GOOD SPACE LOOT!
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Zhagadska
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KundoJet wrote:


  /drug 'Varra



schweeeeeeet 

InVictus Kell - Smuggler for Life
Started: Beta 2
Retired : 1-27-06

It's been fun...
06-16-2005 11:59 AM  

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